Good points, cammy. Also, even with Comparison Charts, people are probably going to buy more paints in the beginning, just out of uncertainty. However, I'm not sure which laws are you referring to, as they differ from country to country, and GW is British. I'm not an expert on law, especially British, or saying you are wrong, but maybe there it is illegal...
Yeah I'm just going off what other people have told me, I haven't had a chance to use the paints myself yet. But the comparison chart is definitely just rough approximations and not 1:1 reproductions, as you can see there are multiple paints in the old range which were different replaced by single paint now. I was really hopeful they'd be 1:1 matches until someone pointed that out. I'll probably buy a pot of the Earthshade which is supposed to replace Devlan Mud and see how it looks (unless I can find somewhere still selling Devlan Mud, which is seeming unlikely). I was under the impression you can't copyright common names. So there's no way you could copyright "blood red", or "ultramarine blue" (and army painter has a colour called ultramarine blue as well), or "bleached bone", since they're all common words/colour names. However something like Kislev Flesh or Caliban Green, since they're not common names and some of them would have copyrighted words in them already, you could copyright them. That was what a few people were suggesting as to why they went with all the new names, they went with names that come directly from existing GW products that aren't common so they could copyright them, rather than the old days of using names that were common. But yeah, I'm not a lawyer or anything, that was just what I thought, you can't copyright common terms. I would think in this day and age they WOULD be able to get damned near perfect colour matches. You have cameras and calibration software capable of picking up very small differences in colour tone these days. I actually think they've done this in the past anyway, back when they went from the tall hexagonal pop top bottles (which were great bottles mind you) to the crappy screw top bottles, I'm sure they changed the mixtures of some paints. Maybe they went from one manufacturer to another, but I could swear painting Bleached Bone with my old Bleached Bone results in a different tone than painting it with the newer ones, and a lot of colours spread differently, requiring more or less layers to get the same effect or requiring thinning to a different consistency.
I went to a GW store today to get some Devlan Mud from the one store that still had some (half an hour drive out of my way on my way back from work ). Got to try out some of the new paints. The base paints seem nice, they give pretty good coverage and don't look quite as drab as the current foundation paints (which is either good or bad depending on what effect you're trying to achieve). I really liked the white, one coat even over black gave you a decent base for another colour, or 2 coats actually gave a solid white. Given how much of a pain in the arse it is to do something like white or bone colour over a dark base, this is a nice addition. The shades look ok, I didn't really get to play around with them as much as I'd have liked, but they seem to give a good effect. The black wash I tried wasn't quite as strong as the old black wash, but seemed to give a reasonably smooth finish.
Really? The new black wash is not as strong as badab black?? Wow... I found badab to be pretty weak, especially compared to what the older ink was like, I don't think I'd have a use for one even weaker than badab black. When I use a black wash I really want the recesses to go black and the upper layers to get darker, otherwise you'd just use a shade of the colour you had instead..
Do you guys know if they have fixed the differences in viscosity of different colours? I mean, I'm not sure if this is a problem or intentional, but some paints, like Commando Khaki and Shadow Grey are really fluid, almost like washes. For the scales of my Cold One, I mixed Shadow Grey and Army Painter's Black and it was almost like washing the model instead of painting. I'd prefer my paints having more similar consistency.
I'm pretty sure thats mostly random actually and is therefore most likely still aorund. There are some colours that tend to be thicker or thinner than others... But in my experience, every blood red I have bought has been quite thick, but my friends say every pot they bought with overly thin and watery. So yeah, nevr know what you might get.
That's what it seemed like to me, though maybe I just wasn't applying it quite as thickly. I wasn't using my own brushes or miniatures. Was playing around with it on some Eldar, washing over a white undercoat resulted in a dark grey in the crevices and a light grey on the raised areas, whereas my old Badab I found gave a darker blackish brown in the crevices and a lighter greyish brown on the raised areas when washed over a white. The new black wash seemed more black, but not quite as strong as the old one. But maybe I just wasn't applying it quite as thick, it was on some of the store models so I didn't bring them home to compare. I wonder if the difference in consistency is due to the crappy paint pots, so if its been sitting on the shelf for several months it might be thicker than one which just came out of the factory recently. I know I bought two pots of a Devlan Mud a while back and though they were the same colour, one went on significantly thicker than the other.
Found somewhere selling some coloured metallics, not the Testors ones though. There's a prototype of the Necrons in my painting log... http://www.lustria-online.com/viewtopic.php?p=69964#p69964 I'm gonna keep looking for the Testors paints though, the ones I used to paint that Necron were terrible, difficult to use and I'm worried its not going to dry properly since I painted that about 18 hours ago and the paint is still soft enough that if I grab the model too hard it leaves a fingerprint, it doesn't feel tacky or sticky, its just soft (even though I didn't even lay it on very thick). Made me realise GW paints really aren't that bad!
I went and got a bunch of the new paints to try them out. Did a spot of painting with them and they seem good so far. The Dry range is incredibly thick, but still manages to stay smooth somehow. I wonder how those will hold up over time. So far Base white and Dry white (don't remember exact names) are my favourites.
I didn't buy any dry paints, but I did play with them in the store. I hope GW fixed their pots so they don't dry out over time, otherwise those already thick dry paints aren't going to last long. I'm not convinced they have fixed the pots, they don't seem terribly tightly sealed, not like the old hex pots tat never dry out and have a really tight cap.
grabbed one of the Texture paints on saturday to start my Ork basing - i really don't think it'll last long. it's pretty thick with all that sand in it and you almost have to slop it on like you would with PVA glue. That being said though it's a great way to get basic bases done really quickly.
Yeah I was tempted by the texture paints, oddly enough for my orCs (have around 1600pts of painted Orcs and Goblins which aren't based). I reckon it'd take 2 or 3 or maybe even 4 or more pots to do the 100 or so bases, making it significantly more expensive than PVA and sand. BUT, it'd probably save me a day or two, so it might be worth forking over the money to get them done faster, also I end up wasting a lot of paint basing with sand anyway. These days I value my time more than my money, since I have such little free time to work on my minis these days I don't like wasting it. If you can I'd love to see your results from using the texture paints for basing.
Here's a pretty comprehensive review of the new paints... http://taleofpainters.blogspot.com.au/2012/04/review-citadel-paint-range.html
Photobucket is blocked at work - something about violating the internet usage policy blah blah. When i get home i'll upload and post that pic of the Orks i've based. EDIT: pic uploaded
anyone try to use the drys as a layer yet? I'm really disapointed to see such a small range of bright colored layers. Seems like the lightest old paints just becme drys.
Haven't bought any of the dry paints as of yet. Ended up getting myself the grey texture paint (Astrogranite). The trick seems to be laying it on really thick (or else do 2 coats I guess). The grit is quite fine, similar to very fine sand, so a lot of the "texture" comes by globbing it on thick to create larger blobs and divits which are held in place while drying by the finer grit stuff. It definitely is fast, I'm a bit disappointed they picked such bright colours though. It'd be better if they were darker and then drybrush up to a highlight. Instead you have to apply it then wash down to a shade and drybrush up to a highlight. By itself I wouldn't recommend it, but if you're planning on using flock or something as well, it'd probably be sufficient. Here's a Hormagaunt base using the Astrogranite... Excuse the low quality, there's only so much detail an iphone 3GS will pick up! That's 1 thick layer of Astrogranite, a quick drybrush of light grey, a black wash and then another drybrush of light grey. It wasn't super fast because of the fact I had to wait for it to dry between coats, but I think if I were doing a whole army, I could probably work my way through a decent sized army in a single afternoon, compared to PVA and sand which might take me a couple of days to do a whole army. I might buy the brown version for my Orcs and Gobbos and use this grey version for my Tyranids, as I have roughly 1600pts of O&G and 1200pts Tyranids which aren't based yet. Remember, that's a 25mm base which is heavily zoomed it, so it looks quite coarse grit in that picture but in reality it's very fine.
After playing around with the Astrogranite on a few models I think I've figured out a pretty good and fast way of using it. Just apply it with a big flat brush like this... http://www.finearttips.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/flat.jpg Apply it around 0.5 to 1mm thick (pretty darned thick!) then wait for maybe 10-20 minutes for it to start to dry (I didn't actually time it, just a guess) and attack it with something like a toothpick or pin to create a rough texture (I used a pin as it's what's on my hobby table, I'm sure a toothpick would work fine). Because of the fine grit, it should hold its shape while it dries. Instead of waiting 5-10 minutes the logical alternative is to do bases in batches big enough so that the first base is slightly dried by the time you finish with the last. Then for the Astrogranite grey, wait for it to fully dry (will take a while since it was applied so thick), apply a black wash and then drybrush with a light grey (I used 3:2 mix of Adeptus Battlegrey:Astronomicon Grey). It actually comes out with quite a good texture, I'll post some pics of a base I did like this when I can. The downside is 0.5mm to 1mm thick of paint is a lot and I don't think the tin of paint will last long, I'm just gonna start painting and see how far it gets, though not this weekend as I have too much other work to do. Is the Vallejo Texture paint similar? Maybe I'll try and get a tin of that as it's a HELL of a lot cheaper, once again it comes down to finding an Australian supplier for it But I'm sold on texture paints, makes life so much quicker than PVA, sand and then applying a coat of paint. EDIT: Ok, here's the pictures... Astrogranite Nuln Oil Light Grey (Adeptus Battlegrey pictured, but its actually a mix of Adeptus and Astronomicon) Finished base...
Wow, thanks for the detailed experimentation, Skink! They look really good for such a quick job. Also, love the river of plasma ^^ I have yet to base any of my models, but maybe I'll start to do it with those new Texture paints. They look promising, easy and I'm still in the very beginning in building my Lizardmen...
Yeah, the green slime river wasn't terribly quick I forgot how many coats of paint it takes to get a solid finish of Scorpion Green. That river is about 10-15 coats of paint worth. Most of the time it took to do the texture was just waiting for things to dry since I only did 1 base, but the actual applications were only a few seconds each so doing a whole regiment or army should be quick (using the 1cm wide square flat brush for all of it). One big advantage for me is going to be how much it simplifies painting. Many of my models I don't glue them to the base while painting so that I can paint the base separately, meaning I either have to awkwardly hold the model while painting or hold them with a pin which requires drilling a hole, but with the texture paint many of those models (not all of course) I reckon I can get away with gluing them down before painting without making the actual basing process complicated, which will save time not only for the basing but the actual painting as well. The one question in my mind is just how many pots of the stuff you'll need to do an army. I haven't actually tested it, but just mathematically a pot is 12ml... 12 ml = 12,000 cubic millimeters If applying 0.5mm thick it will cover an area of... 12000/0.5 = 24,000 squared millimeters That sounds like a lot, but a 25mm square base would be 25x25 = 625 mm^2 per base, 24000/625 = 38 bases off a single tin of paint. So 20mm square base = 60 bases per pot 25mm square = 38 bases 25x50mm cavalry = 19 50x100mm chariot base = 4.8 25mm round = 49 40mm round = 19 60mm round = 8.5 big 40k oval base = 3-ish (just estimated the area) That's an underestimate on the number of bases you can do of course, as you have the angled bits on the side which slightly reduce the area you're applying the texture over and also you have the models feet which take up a portion of the base as well (Raveners use a 40mm round base but their tail takes up most of it, while the hormagaunt uses a 25mm base but barely touches it so you have to cover the entire thing). That's also assuming a 0.5mm thick layer of the texture, if you use slightly more or slightly less it'll have an effect on the number of bases you can do. When I think of it compared to the actual cost of GW miniatures these days it's not a huge addition. Sure I can only do 9 or so Thunderwolves with 60mm round bases per pot... but those 9 Thunderwolves also happen to cost a couple of hundred dollars anyway so the few bucks extra of paint isn't gonna kill me. Ever since GW repackaged regiments as 10 models per box instead of 20 models per box the cost of assembling an army has skyrocketed.
I don't think that will work. The Dry range works very well for drybrushing but it is too thick for any other work. @AllSeeingSkink: Good job and thanks for sharing. I think the old PVA+sand before basecoat is plenty fast enough, but I did get a pot of that stuff to just to try it.