1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Don't have enough monsters? Or just want to show off your painting skills. Why not try entering the Monster Mash! - Click here for more info.
    Dismiss Notice

Tutorial The art of Summoning

Discussion in 'Seraphon Tactics' started by Killer Angel, Nov 9, 2018.

  1. DeathBringer125
    Ripperdactil

    DeathBringer125 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    472
    Likes Received:
    588
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Unfortunately I had to cancel it today. But we should be able to play next week. Plus, by then, I will have 5 converted razordons hehehe.
     
  2. Blitzkriyg
    Skink

    Blitzkriyg New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Vortex doesn't increase spell range

    Edit : was the +1 to cast they removed, not range
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2018
  3. LizardWizard
    Bastiladon

    LizardWizard Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    770
    Likes Received:
    888
    Trophy Points:
    93
    It does. You can add 6" to the range of any spell. Warscroll here.
     
    Blitzkriyg likes this.
  4. Blitzkriyg
    Skink

    Blitzkriyg New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Ah yep, it was the +1 to cast they removed, not the range
     
  5. LizardWizard
    Bastiladon

    LizardWizard Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    770
    Likes Received:
    888
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I am pretty sure the +1 to cast was removed solely because of Kroak and Orcs Foot of Gork. lol
     
  6. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

    Messages:
    8,378
    Likes Received:
    11,618
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yep. But IIRC the Gaunt Summoner also had something.
     
    LizardWizard likes this.
  7. Canas
    Skar-Veteran

    Canas Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,569
    Likes Received:
    3,004
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Meh, he mostly benefited from the range. It made it much easier to hit with his spell as a unit needs to be entirely within 18" not just the one straggler of a congaline. The +1 to casting helps, but I doubt it's what made it so good on him.
     
    LizardWizard and Aginor like this.
  8. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

    Messages:
    8,378
    Likes Received:
    11,618
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You are right, it was the range for him.
     
    Canas and LizardWizard like this.
  9. Killer Angel
    OldBlood

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

    Messages:
    4,290
    Likes Received:
    6,743
    Trophy Points:
    113
    With all the bonuses to cast available to so many armies, it would be nice to have some reliable bonus to unbind attempts...
     
  10. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

    Messages:
    8,378
    Likes Received:
    11,618
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yeah, I really wondered if it would kill the balance of the game if you just used casting bonuses for unbinding as well.
     
  11. Killer Angel
    OldBlood

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

    Messages:
    4,290
    Likes Received:
    6,743
    Trophy Points:
    113
    IMO they should come from different sources. So you need to spend resources to have both of them, trying to find the right balance between defence and offence.
     
  12. Canas
    Skar-Veteran

    Canas Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,569
    Likes Received:
    3,004
    Trophy Points:
    113
    mwha, imho bonusses to unbinding shouldn't be needed in 99% of the cases, even if +1 to casting is fairly common. If we take us as an example we can get +2 to cast with an astrolith & a slann with the right constalation. However, this requires 2 different models, and some luck. Which imho makes it acceptable. There's a fairly decent cost involved by having to field 2 models, it relies on luck with the constelation, the models aren't that difficult to kill. So there's enough to fiddle around with to call that balanced.

    However, characters like Nagash that just have a 3+ bonus for merely existing are rather problematic. Against those a better mechanic than just "murder the thing" is needed. Though in fairness Nagash is just Always going to be flat out broken with regards to magic as long as he keeps his ridiculous bonusses. Being able to cast 9 times when the second highest is 4 and the average is 1 is just silly, just like having a 3+ bonus without needing to work for it is rather stupid. Nagash just kinda needs to be reigned in if they want magic to actually get somewhere without constantly needing bandaids like the rule of one to stop him from singlehandedly wiping out armies in 1 turn.

    I can't think of any good mechanic for it though. Just making anti-wizard units that have a +1 to unbinding will result in either an arms race to the bottom, or eventually a stalemate where both sides just Always have say a +3 bonus. Plus if the anti-wizards become common enough it'l make wizard-based armies even more annoying to actually use, the rule of 1 already can make it a pain at times. Something like a anti-astrolith would be obnoxious as hell as a wizard to deal with since there's relativly little the wizard can do if the anti-astrolith just hangs in the back. Maybe a unit that gives a +1 to unbinding if it is very close to the wizard. At least then they first have to catch the wizard as well so the wizard has at least some time to strike first?
     
  13. Killer Angel
    OldBlood

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

    Messages:
    4,290
    Likes Received:
    6,743
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I don't know.
    But as a general idea for AoS, I would have liked more "easy" access to unbind bonuses rather then increased range for unbind attempts.
     
  14. Canas
    Skar-Veteran

    Canas Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,569
    Likes Received:
    3,004
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Meh, I would've liked a completly different magical system to be honest. Right now there's barely any difference between magic and command abilities or just general "special" abilities, and there's a distinct lack of synergy across spells in most cases. Plus 99% are just damage spells. That combined with the rule of 1 and the fact that you nearly Always need a wizard per spell as most only have 1 cast makes interesting magic interactions rather lackluster. It leaves wizards often feeling like glorified artillery, and often like they have no real impact on their own. Don't get me wrong, that D3 mortal wound is gonna matter, even if it only deals 1 damage each round. But it doesn't exactly feel like a glorious wizard raining destruction upon his enemies. And similarly, stuff like summon starlight will severly impact certain units, but due to it being a (fairly) minor debuff of -1 to hit you only really see it if for units that have a "on a 6 or higher, trigger bonus nonsense"-mechanic. If the don't have it that -1 to hit just dissapears into a load of dicerolls and you now suffers slightly less wounds, but unless you activly keep track of every wound "prevented" in this way you won't really be able to tell.
     
  15. tom
    Skink

    tom Member

    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    20
    Trophy Points:
    8
    As far as I know, we are the only people with access to a rerollable unbind using arcane might, and it's global!
     
  16. Killer Angel
    OldBlood

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

    Messages:
    4,290
    Likes Received:
    6,743
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That's true, but it's once per phase and you need to skip the double teleport. Hard to justify it, especially if you compare it to the new ridiculous "counterspell" abilities that are going to hit the battlefield (Infernal Enrapturess, I'm looking at you)
     
  17. tom
    Skink

    tom Member

    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    20
    Trophy Points:
    8
    I'd not seen that warscroll, having looked it seems like arcane might would help there too, you'd want to fail the first cast then reroll for a successful one Can't reroll a reroll so you're good to go!

    Do lots of people run great remeberer? It's my least used choice.. Are you using it to reroll a failed tp or to move two units per turn ?
     
  18. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

    Messages:
    8,378
    Likes Received:
    11,618
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Both.

    I like to use it together with a Shadowstrike for maximum focus fire, for example.
     

Share This Page