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9th Age Trouble with HBE

Discussion in 'Lizardmen & Saurian Ancients Tactics' started by The Hunted, Aug 11, 2016.

  1. The Hunted
    Carnasaur

    The Hunted Active Member

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    Hello everybody!

    I humbly stand before thy, to plead for help.

    I often face a HBE opponent and we generally play some smaller games (~1500 points).
    His list is what I would describe as a 'counter' list. For reference, I'm putting a general overview of his list:

    High Prince, Royal Huntsmen, Lion Chariot, GW, Items to improve his save(s).
    Commander, BSB. Defensive kit (pretty naked, most of the time)
    Mage, lore of fire/maxed out on magical missiles.

    30+ seaguards, FC. BSB and mage go here. The size simply depends on the minimum core requirements

    ~7 Knights of Ryma, FC

    2 Sea Guard reapers with repeating shots.



    Once again, that is a pretty general overview of his list. The numbers may vary a bit, but this is what it boils down to.
    I describe it as a 'counter' list, because he has the range advantage. So I have to attack him. He has 2 fast and hard-hitting units and 1 big block with a whole load of attacks. He simply points his shooting to my faster units and only moves to counter my threatening units.
    The problem I'm facing is that I leave my flanks exposed when I just rush forward, but if I'm not aggressive enough; he shoots me of the board (or weakens me too much that advancing is suicide).

    My (rough) list the last 2 times we played (barely scraped out a draw)

    Skink High Priest, Heavens, scroll
    Skink chief BSB on Taurosaur with Fleshrender/Ogre Sword

    28 Saurian Warriors, FC, Spears

    5 skink hunters, blowpipe
    5 skink hunters, blowpipe, vanguard

    Salamander
    Spearback
    Stygiosaur w/champion upgrade.


    Summary of those battles: I redwood shafted his general to do some wounds, later finishing him in combat. His knights heavily wounded my BSB on Taurosaur on the charge, after that we grinded and it's a 50/50 who wins. My Saurian Warriors beat his Sea guard and finished them off, but losing so much models in the process that it's mop-up for the reapers/anything.
    His reapers and magic focus on my skinks and weapon beasts, so redirecting and blocking him becomes much harder.

    So, help is appreciated! What am I doing wrong, what could I do better/list changes etc.
    I do have other models to come and play, so feel free to give me a hand here :).

    Any and all help is much appreciated!

    The Hunted
     
  2. Lawot
    Kroxigor

    Lawot Active Member

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    I think Heavens is a great call, for its ranged attacks - in particular, a Comet in his deployment zone should do a number on his sit-back-and-shoot strategy.

    How do you see the role of the Taurosaur and Stygiosaur? I'd be inclined to put a fighty Saurian character in the Saurus block, or bring a Warlord on Raptor in a unit of Riders to help you punch through his combat units with fewer losses.

    I'd also consider spending some Core points on a big Swarm unit to tie up his Knights or Sea Guard. They don't need to do a lot of damage, just last long enough to keep your serious stuff from getting flanked.

    A Skrox unit as Core would give you more bodies to absorb fire, and high-S attacks to deal with the Cav.

    I know Weapon Beasts theoretically distribute their fire most efficiently if they are separated, but they can actually function as combat support units if they are combined into one unit.

    Overall, I think our skirmishers and access to M6 means that it should be doable to out maneuver the HBE and get to those Reapers.
     
  3. The Hunted
    Carnasaur

    The Hunted Active Member

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    Thanks for the help :)

    The Stygiosaur is there to guarantee 2 amazing spells from the Path of Wilderness. But it might be too expensive for doing just that.
    Taurosaur is there to counter-charge (in theory), but his movement cannot compete with that of the HBE cavalry.

    I like the idea of a Scaiman unit, I only have to avoid the Seaguard like the plague :p. But they should to fine then.

    Weapon beasts as combat support...possibly, but I really like them going solo. Might just have to try it out one day though!

    My skinks just had a rough couple of games, getting blasted of the board Turns 1 and 2. I will keep fielding them and be more aggressive with my entire army. To try and overload his ranged potential.

    Once again, thanks for your input; it gets my gears grinding over the next list :)


    The Hunted
     
  4. Lawot
    Kroxigor

    Lawot Active Member

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    Best of luck to you!
     
  5. Rokanos
    Kroxigor

    Rokanos Well-Known Member

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    Have you tried using the stampede spear on your bsb plus the sharpened horns upgrade for the re-rollable 2d6 impact hits?

    Also - I know those dirty elves have decent leadership, but don't forget your Stygiosaur causes terror. It has done wonders for me when the opponent least expects it. Don't be afraid to get aggressive with the Stygiosaur either.

    Do you have the points to possibly make both units of skink hunters a single unit with chameleon?
     
  6. The Hunted
    Carnasaur

    The Hunted Active Member

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    I have not tried the Charge-beast Taurosaur, I am very afraid it will not get the charge off; but gets charged in return.
    Problem with HBE is that not only do they have good leadership, they also have Martial Discipline for some unbeknown reason...Meaning they are cold-blooded when it comes to Fear&Terror :/
    As far as being aggressive; I would want to, but haven't had the chance thusfar. He always ends up on 1-2 wounds before even getting close to seeing combat. And at that point..I'd rather stay out of it entirely!

    I probably have the points for 1 big(ish) chameleon unit, but what do I do with it? Snipe his Bolt Throwers?

    Thanks for the input nonetheless!


    The Hunted
     
  7. Rokanos
    Kroxigor

    Rokanos Well-Known Member

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    ah, wasn't aware of the martial discipline, that's kinda...weird.

    yeah, snipe the bolt throwers and then pick away at either his mounted guys or his big block with poison shots. Eventually he'll fail armor saves.

    As for setting up the charge for the taurosaur, that is definitely a problem (and one reason I don't take them).

    Hmm.. You could take a core of Scaiman units, drop the chief from the mount and still have him as bsb, then take a second styg with champ maybe? If you do that though, i'd drop the high skink priest and turn that mass of points into a old blood on a raptor or something.

    I usually answer a boring shoot em up army with speed and agressiveness. Usually works out, unless you fail every charge lol.
     
  8. The Hunted
    Carnasaur

    The Hunted Active Member

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    Well, I played another game today. And I managed to win via massacre =D.

    I used 2x 22/2 Scaiman, 20 TG with Cuatl lord and 4 Ramphodons as my main units. The Scaimans kept his Cavalry busy for long enough (sacrificed one of the units, the Caimans actually managed to knock out his BSB on horseback), while my TG marched out in front of the rest of his army. He charged them, killed a whole bunch; but I managed to hold out for my other Scaiman and Ramphodon to come to the rescue and mop up his Seaguards, general and mage.
    We called the game there. I was going to get his Bolt Throwers, while his cavalry were in a bad spot with me having lots of units still standing. Depleted, but still standing.

    So; Speed and aggression worked out! And I found a new love for Skink-Caiman :). Thanks for the help, the tips you guys gave helped out in designing and playing the army.


    The Hunted
     
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  9. Rokanos
    Kroxigor

    Rokanos Well-Known Member

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    Woo! Nicely done!

    I thought I'd hate the Scaiman blocks myself, but they are surprisingly effective. Keep us informed on your next games!
     
  10. Lawot
    Kroxigor

    Lawot Active Member

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    Nice job! I wouldn't have thought to do 2x smaller Scaiman units. Sounds like it worked out perfectly!
     

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