Hey! I've made a list that gives a a scar vet a 2+, Old blood 3+ 5+, a Slann and a Skink priest (1000 points on the dot for characters scratches my brain something good) and haven't come across it in other lists so just wanted to put the word out and from what i can see it's legal?? Lizardmen - 2000 Slann + Old Blood - [1999pts] # ++ Main Force ++ [1999pts] ## Characters [1000pts] Saurus Oldblood [410pts]: Hand Weapon, Heavy Armour, Carnosaur (Heavy Armour, Slashing talons), Armour of Silvered Steel, Giant Blade, Talisman Of Protection Saurus Scar-Veteran [155pts]: Hand Weapon, Heavy Armour, Shield, Hide Of The Cold Ones, Sword of Swiftness, Cold One (Hand Weapon) Skink Priest [120pts]: Hand Weapon, Light Armour, Wizard Level 2, Battle Magic, Ruby Ring of Ruin Slann Mage-Priests [315pts]: • 1x Slann Mage-Priest [315pts]: Hand Weapon, General, Wizard Level 4, High Magic, Lore Familiar ## Core [536pts] Saurus Warriors [336pts]: Thrusting Spear • 21x Saurus Warrior [14pts]: Hand Weapon, Heavy Armour, Shield • 1x Spawn Leader [7pts] • 1x Standard Bearer [7pts] • 1x Musician [7pts] Skink Skirmishers [70pts]: Scouts • 12x Skink [5pts]: Hand Weapon, Light Armour, Javelins and Shields Skink Skirmishers [70pts]: Scouts • 12x Skink [5pts]: Hand Weapon, Light Armour, Javelins and Shields Skink Skirmishers [60pts]: • 12x Skink [5pts]: Hand Weapon, Light Armour, Javelins and Shields ## Special [463pts] Bastiladon [180pts]: Thunderous bludgeon, Solar Engine, 4x Skink Crew (Hand Weapon, Javelin) Cold One Riders [283pts]: Drilled • 6x Cold One Rider [35pts]: Cold One (Hand Weapon), Hand Weapon, Heavy Armour, Shield, Cavalry Spear • 1x Pack Leader [7pts] • 1x Standard Bearer [47pts]: Sun Standard Of Chotec • 1x Musician [7pts] Armour of the silvered steel is the 3+ which ive taken over meteoric because unless im running into AP -2 I think its better? Giants blade for some more offence and TOP for the 5+ Scar Vet with Heavy Armour, Shield, Hide of the cold one (which I dont mind adding the stupidity because he's going in with the Cold ones anyway) and then Armoured hide from the Cold one gives him the 2+! My thoughts on the sword of swiftness is for when the inevitable happens and fail stupidity and get charged myself - he should (hopefully) do enough by himself to thin the fighting rank a little bit to help keep the 1W boys hes with a chance and fighting back The Priest being in there to help the Slann through vassel and harras (id throw him in with the skins for some protection) The pin cushion would be relying on getting ethereal through and is everyone sleeping on Drain Magic? from what i can tell you dont need LOS for it give the -2 its just a bubble so he could be hiding behind cover and still give the DeBuff (let me know if im wrong please and would be bubble stay where the spell has been cast from or would it follow the Slann around because it remains in play) I like to run my Warriors 7 wide so 21 just looks nice plus with 2 Att each and spears 21 attacks in combat sounds nice but could also run them 6 wide at 19 total (for core minimum) and drop 1 skin and swap the basti for a Steg Skinks will be skinks - ive found 12 is a nice number for coherency and playing with the rule of 3 The Standard is a bit of a toss up there are a couple good options with the +1 combat res or re-rolling charge but with swiftstride you'd hope that one of the die thrown would be kind to you hahah but -1 to being shot at and not giving the chance for a stand and shoot charge reaction (once again just hoping to have something help with a round of being stupid) And to wrap it all up the basti I really like him even though the fireball isn't the easiest to get off but he's just a tank and I think helps wrap it all up + more dinos = rule of cool But yea let me know what you think
I've not run cold one riders but I've personally never understood why you'd want the scar vet inside the unit. Outside he still can't be targetted by missiles but he has 360 degree vision arc. And can flank charge. It is a very clever list, it is not the way I would do it but I don't see anything "wrong". The way I would do it would be... swap the old blood and scar vet's mounts around. Take a horned one for the old blood and then take bedazzling helm. Now you are at 2+ and -1 to hit and are faster and have lost stupid. With the last 30 points you can either take a talisman of protection (if you don't want it on the carno) or take a biting blade and maybe a charmed shield. If you do take the talisman of protection I usually take a great weapon as the cav spear is crap compared to the obidisan blade. Mind you, a lot of the game I use the obisdian blade and not the great weapon but its nice to have the punch if you need it. As for the carnosaur, yes I like the armour of meteroic iron. TOW seems that a lot is -1AP and not much is -2AP anyway so the question of silvered steel is points for 4+ vs always having 5+ always. A scar vet can take the ToP and armour of metoric iron and a great weapon. Or, you can take the Glyph Necklace if the ToP is taken, and a shield for missiles. Either way, a great weapon is a perfect fit. Mind you, having zero magic items might be an issue if ethereal comes up. Also having a BSB is really nice! Not only for saving a bad roll for your army (the only game I've lost with a carnosaur I lost combat by 1 because of ranks and rolled 11 for break) but the additional combat res is nice. I personally prefer vanguard over scouts, scouts can be hard to deploy and usually rob us of the +1 for going first.
thank you for the reply, Can you let me know why he can't be targeted by missiles? Crap i've been using newrecruit as a list builder and it doesn't give me the option of bedazzling helm - i've just looked at old world builder and bam there it is so ill definetly take your advice and do some playing around It looks like Silvered Steel is a 3+ that can't be improved but on the scarvet with only 10 points left doesnt give you too many options besides an enchanted/charmed shield or horned one so ToP and something else could be the go here- i really like the great weapon option, ill be putting that in for sure. I think it's crazy that the Carnosaur doesn't give armoured hide but it is what it is I guess I did run into the issue of not having a magic weapon available vs ethereal but luckily enough it was near the end of the game so it wasn't a too much of a biggie Great point, ill be sure to chuck one in - ahh crap that's rough, the dice only want to be high when youre making the panic test i rolled a 6,6 and 5 a lost my saurus which felt reaaaaaaaaal good hahah I get you, I like the scout just to be a pest and force some attention to them - little mind games are always fun
1) ancient blood: much better with destiny armor and great weapon. 2) scar veteran with protection talisman and Horned one+ great weapon. 3) the cavalry on cold one sucks quite badly, the stupidity is emasculating unfortunately.
Maybe something like the below? I will not be keeping him in a unit of cold ones Saurus Oldblood [264 pts] +2, 5+ Ward Discomute mentioned that he can't be targeted by missiles do you know what enables that? - Great Weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Cold One - Horned One - Talisman of Protection - Bedazzling Helm Saurus Scar-Veteran [361 pts] - Great Weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shield - Battle Standard Bearer [War Banner] - Carnosaur - Glyph Necklace
Don't forget the sheild for the oldblood to get him to 2+. He will have to drop it in combat if he wants the great weapon but often he won't as st5 -1ap is still good. You make the decision on what weapon you want to use before the combat and can't switch it until combat is over like is FBIGO but not a GG Page 206 targetting lone characters. He needs to stay in 3" of the cold ones (and they need to have 5+ models) and he also needs to hang back just a bit so he's not the absolute closest target. Then he can't be shot at. Edit also note the FAQ in relation to cannonballs. Have to hit you on the head for it to count, the bounce won't get you PS don't let people talk you out of cold ones if you like them. Stupidity is bad for us this edition but they are priced that way. High risk high reward
Yep yep yep 2 handed and all that, good to know FBIGO is out of combat and GG continues Ohh gotcha gotcha, I didn’t realise the within 3” rule thank you! Mainly running them because I have the models and they’ve been good to me so far, what are you thoughts on putting a lone character in a block of SW or TG?
I haven't tried it yet but I have a friend with beastmen who has done well creating a massive unit block "death star" of old. Certainly you get less benefit from lone infantry as skirmisher... Skirmish is still good but your Movement is 4" instead of 8" plus swiftstride. So the 360 arc isn't quite as great. Overall I might do it for a BSB in a unit but those death stars can be easy to avoid to for the right list. So... Overall... Worth trying
You totally can. Stupidity however is a big downside, and tbh, i think Cold One Riders are one of our worst units, especially if you start decking them out with magical items as one failed stupidity test can mean their doom. They are just too expensive for what they bring even without stupidity, have no good rules like Countercharge or First Charge, are slow as cav (movement 7 means other cavalry will more often than not charge you). Take a Great Weapon over the Giant Blade, it is a lot better and basically cheaper. Meteoric Iron is also better than Silvered Steel. Things that will kill you have high S and often high AP (else it just bounces off your T6), so generally Meteoric Iron, ToP on a Scarvet with a GW is seen as the cheapest and strongest loadout. High Magic is also seen as one of the less good lores. If you want more damage, Plague of Rust and the 1 2 punch of Wind Blast plus Elemental Spirit (push them through your own elemental spirit) just does more damage than anything High Magic brings. High Magic mainly brings Walk between Worlds to give the unit the caster is with Ethereal, but since our Slann cant join units that is kinda eh. Consensus seems to be that Battle Magic is best at chaff clearing with Pillar and Fireball, Elementalism is most alround and Illusion is best vs monsters and of course needed for Doppleganger tricks for Ethereal Slann. It will also 100% be better to put that Ruby Ring on the Slann, that Skink will die quick. Idk why you take him any way btw, he will not be able to cast much vs a lvl 4. I would go for a lvl 1 on a steg, drop your cold one scarvet mostly for the Arcane Vassal tricks to cast stuff while your Slann is outside of dispel range. Also drop some Saurus Warriors, you want 500 points of core, nothing more. You also do not need the 4th skink on the Bastie, but you can i guess. Lots of small improvements you can still make in the list!
I've been testing this lately, I won minorly against orcs and Chaos. Both with lv 4 mage === Test [2000 pts] Warhammer: The Old World, Lizardmen === ++ Characters [999 pts] ++ Saurus Oldblood [386 pts] - Great weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shield - General - Carnosaur - Armour of Destiny Saurus Scar-Veteran [179 pts] - Great weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shield - Battle Standard Bearer - Cold One - Talisman of Protection - Horned One Saurus Scar-Veteran [162 pts] - Great weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Cold One - Aura Of Quetzl - Horned One Saurus Scar-Veteran [154 pts] - Great weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shield - Cold One - Potion of Foolhardiness - Hide Of The Cold Ones - Horned One - Charmed Shield Skink Chief [118 pts] - Additional hand weapon - Light armour (Calloused hide) - Ripperdactyl - Biting Blade - Armour of Meteoric Iron ++ Core Units [516 pts] ++ 24 Saurus Warriors [381 pts] - Hand weapons - Shields - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shieldwall - Spawn Leader (champion) - Standard bearer - Musician 15 Skink Skirmishers [85 pts] - Hand weapons - Javelins - Shields - Light armour (Calloused hides) - Scouts 10 Skink Skirmishers [50 pts] - Hand weapons - Javelins - Shields - Light armour (Calloused hides) ++ Special Units [230 pts] ++ Bastiladon [175 pts] - Hand weapons - Javelins - Thunderous bludgeon - Solar Engine 5 Chameleon Skinks [55 pts] - Blowpipes - Hand weapons - Light armour (Calloused hides) ++ Rare Units [255 pts] ++ Ancient Stegadon [255 pts] - Hand weapons - Javelins - Great horns - Engine of the Gods --- Created with "Old World Builder" [https://old-world-builder.com]
Looks interesting for sure. Only clear upgrade i can see is less Saurus and 3 units of 10 Skink Skirmishers. It is our best unit by far, every army without at least 3 units of 10 is just doing something wrong from a competitive perspective if you ask me. All the solo characters are interesting,, are they joining the Saurus or running solo? Also the shield on one of the scarvets is 2 points wasted i think,, if you have Meteroric Iron you can never have a save better than 5+, so the shield is wasted on him. I also personally kinda dislike mono engine as you do not get the casting bonus, but you can run 1 if you really want the Fireball, it is not that bad.
- the hide of the cold ones isn't that good with a horned one, you still have stupidity - i don't think cham skinks are worth their cost - engine isn't worth it with this list - personally i like the scar vet on the carno and old one on a horned one for reasons mentioned above
hey mate, i do agree that the stupidity sucks and one more wound on them would be great but their output is great from what ive played, having countercharge or first charge would be amazing i agree, swiftstride and drilled help them a tad but in comparison it is rough I will be dropping the giant blade from the recommendations and swapping it with the great weapon going forward, good point with the cheapest and strongest, thank you for that! High magic was mainly for the ethereal on himself its rough he cant join a unit but the idea was to keep him alive from being shot at, I was able to kill about 20 tomb king spearman with firey conv when the scatter die didnt move which was a laugh and the other buffs it gives were useful although the short range made it a bit scary to have him that far up however I've been looking more into battle and elementalism for the points you mentioned. I chuck the priest in with the skinks to get for the vassal, when you run your stegs are you mainly wanting them in combat over shooting the bow and just chucking some javs on the way in after you march? Thanks for the tid bits though!
The hide is good, you have 2+ and with horned one you move 8, with potion you have 0 problem to charge for stupidity. Personally i pref engine that giant bow, for the stegadon. it's a tournament list where only 2x are allowed for each unit, which is why I play chameleons
Running solo, seeing 360 degrees is better. unfortunately I can't play 3x of skinks and a maximum of 6 magic levels are playable. I'm testing for a tournament, where the limit per unit is 2x and you can have max two behemoths
Rule of 2 is pretty annoying for us, but i guess it is rough for anyone. I do like to run Chameleons even in hard rule of 3 environments, can totally see running them if you can only run 2 units of Skinks. How do you mean with potion there is no problem with Stupidity, there is no potion in the game that makes it so you get to charge even when you failed your Stupidity... ? Potion of Foolhardiness does nothing against Stupidity if that is what you mean, that potion only works vs Terror, Panic and Fear, NOT Stupidity. Only thing that helps a little bit is ld 9 with the Slann, and even then you will still often fail it if you roll that 10+ on 2 dice. Do note that BSB does not give you a reroll on your stupidity check, that is a mistake i have seen made sometimes.
I actually modified the previous list a bit. Tested against beastman, won by minor. I must say that the salamanders behaved very well. I still have to play more games against people with more armor. === Test [2000 pts] Warhammer: The Old World, Lizardmen === ++ Characters [989 pts] ++ Saurus Oldblood [386 pts] - Great weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shield - General - Carnosaur - Armour of Destiny Saurus Scar-Veteran [179 pts] - Great weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shield - Battle Standard Bearer - Cold One - Talisman of Protection - Horned One Saurus Scar-Veteran [164 pts] - Great weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shield - Cold One - Aura Of Quetzl - Horned One Saurus Scar-Veteran [147 pts] - Great weapon - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Cold One - Horned One - Armour of Meteoric Iron - Charmed Shield Skink Chief [113 pts] - Additional hand weapon - Light armour (Calloused hide) - Terradon - Ruby Ring of Ruin - Charmed Shield ++ Core Units [521 pts] ++ 24 Saurus Warriors [381 pts] - Hand weapons - Shields - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Shieldwall - Spawn Leader (champion) - Standard bearer - Musician 15 Skink Skirmishers [85 pts] - Hand weapons - Javelins - Shields - Light armour (Calloused hides) - Scouts 10 Skink Skirmishers [55 pts] - Hand weapons - Javelins - Shields - Light armour (Calloused hides) - Vanguard ++ Special Units [55 pts] ++ 5 Chameleon Skinks [55 pts] - Blowpipes - Hand weapons - Light armour (Calloused hides) ++ Rare Units [435 pts] ++ Ancient Stegadon [255 pts] - Hand weapons - Javelins - Great horns - Engine of the Gods 1 Salamander Pack [90 pts] - Wicked claws - Fiery breath - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - 3x Skink Handlers with Hand weapons and Light armour (Calloused hides) 1 Salamander Pack [90 pts] - Wicked claws - Fiery breath - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - 3x Skink Handlers with Hand weapons and Light armour (Calloused hides) --- Created with "Old World Builder" [https://old-world-builder.com]
How did you salamanders do well. You know they cannot march and shoot right,, that is what makes them trash? Also them missing like half of their shots is just very eh, they cannot stand and shoot. They are like one of the worst units in the book, idk what you are doing with them that makes them ok? How are they working for you? I also see a lack of the potion now, so i guess you learnt something on the forums? I guess i can see the old cowboy strats working, but arent they just shot to bits? They have no opportunity at all to get look out sir in your list, and they will die to like 10 random guys with crossbows.