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Tutorial Seraphon Overview (updated to AoS 3.0)

Discussion in 'Seraphon Tactics' started by Killer Angel, Mar 8, 2020.

  1. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    still sucks if you wanne play Coalesced. Suffering 3 wounds gives you a 2/3th chance of losing your salamander/razordon at msu. At maximum size 8 wounds are enough to guarantee the loss of a salamander (either to battleshock or to the wounds) and if you can get to something like 12-15 wounds you'l probably wipe out all the salamanders even in a max-sized unit (might still be some handlers left depending on how you assign the wounds).

    they're just kind of a weird unit right now when it comes to battleshock. Plus, the handlers just don't do anything which is also weird.
     
  2. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    Battleshock is indeed a problem, especially in a large unit. But of course, unless the enemy don't kill all your handlers at once, they are my first choice of fleeing model.
    with a unit of 3 hunting pack at bravery 5, they kill 5 handlers and i roll a 3... 3 handlers flee.
     
  3. Nart
    Carnasaur

    Nart Well-Known Member

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    No objections. 1:1.

    But not in starborne. And coalesced salamanders have no benifits for shooting, only for melee, which is great, but they are taken for shooting in the first place. In coalesced army the Celestial Harmony is an answer. Need a spare CP, if you are running two squads, which can be a problem. But it is possible to deal with battleshock problem.

    I veiw dread as a tank, not a damage dealer. But lack of synergies ang giant base really kills him as a competivive choice, IMO. But in friendly games he'll be great.
     
  4. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    Update: analysis for units has been completed (leaving aside possible corrections) :)
     
  5. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    Sure, but next time you roll a 6 and now a mere 5 succesfull wounds have wiped out the entire unit. It seems like rather a risky gamble, especially if your opponent is halfway capable and tries to focus down the hunting packs.
     
  6. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    Sure, I'm not saying it is safe, but it's still a possibility (and anyway, it's a risk i would not take with less than 4 disposable handlers)
    Let's say that if the opponent killed 4 handlers and you still have 5, it's basically an auto-pass for the sallies.
     
  7. Erta Wanderer
    OldBlood

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    i don't plan on giving him the chance salamanders that drop from the sky fire and then charge do far more then make up for their points if they die after that oh well. our entire army is glass hammers at least with salamanders you get your monies worth
     
  8. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    remarks:
    - ripper's chief command ability is AoE, and decently large at 18", it also affects himself. A potential interesting use is to bring several msu of rippers. This way your opponent will have difficulty bringing them all down. And with 3-4 units the damage will start stacking up quickly.
    Also, since they're all msu and not particularly impressive it might catch an opponent ofguard if they suddenly have 6-7 attacks per model which also explode on a 6+.

    - EoTG: can be used for some hilarious healing combo's. An EoTG + bound lifeswarm + the healing spell a slann gets allows you to heal something for potentially 3D3. Which is fairly hilarious. Also, with its healing it is reasonaby self-sufficient. Which is nice. It plays vastly different than how it used to, but I'd be very surprised if it wouldn't find it's way back into competitive lists with ease. I mean, just imagine the nonsense you can pull supporting a bastiladon with 3D3 heals.

    - scar vet on cold one/carno: both can be used in the firelance if I understood it correctly.

    - ark of sotek: the average output is actually relativly decent, and the threat of a potential 18 mortal wounds is quite usefull for mind-games. However, it's degrading profile is a major issue. Once you've suffered 7+ wounds it'l struggle to hit anything. There is some potential if you support it with healing though.

    - stegadon: the chief's command ability allows you to double flamer attacks RAW. Which is fairly amazing. It also significantly lowers the amount of targets needed to be usefull.

    - Kroxigor: potential fun use, have them be the honour guard of an EoTG. The EoTG will heal them and trigger the skink buff, the kroxigor will protect the EoTG and help it chew through hordes. Nice little synergy with minimal effort.

    Having them be kamikaze's is one solution I guess :p
     
  9. Lizerd
    Skink Priest

    Lizerd Well-Known Member

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    @Killer Angel im not sold on the idea that carnosaurs are now horde killers, my guess is that they function to take out smaller heroes, or if properly buffed be sent after big monsters. They can hit really hard and can put up a fairly good fight
     
  10. Aktanolt
    Cold One

    Aktanolt Well-Known Member

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    Hi, super cool review, i'm working on a french version of it with my opinion, can i use parts of your review organisation plz ? You'll be quoted ofc :)
     
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  11. Nart
    Carnasaur

    Nart Well-Known Member

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    Great! Thank you very much!

    A couple of remarks:

    1) Can you, please, note in the Stegadon section, that +1 save is only works against single unit with less than 5 models? Otherwise, stegadon may look way better, than it actually is.

    2) On several occasions you mentioned units in Koatl's Claw getting +1 to-hit on charge (Kroxigor, Ripperdactyl). But it only applies to SAURUS units, unfortunately. But still, ripperdactyls can get +2 to-hit - one from shadowstrike ability and another one from Skink Priest's command ability.

    How is it? Flamers don't have attacks characteristics, so you cannot give them +1 attack. And Chief only gives +1 attack on melee weapons.
     
  12. Lizerd
    Skink Priest

    Lizerd Well-Known Member

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    In theory the attacks characteristic is determined by the number of models within range, so I guess you can add bonus attacks to that determined characteristic
     
  13. LizardWizard
    OldBlood

    LizardWizard Grand Skink Handler Staff Member

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    The ScV on Carno can be a super potent hero killer. Take the Spear and apply Sword of Judgement to it. It is quite possible to get the ScV to a +2 to hit with Koatls Claws and an Oldblood Command Ability. Now every 4+ to hit will do d6 MWs to heroes and Monster from your Spear.
     
  14. Lizerd
    Skink Priest

    Lizerd Well-Known Member

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    Dear Sotek that’s terrifying. I was initially thinking about blade of realities on an oldblood as the spear becomes rend -2 which fixes its only issue, and does 4 damage against heroes. But yeah sword of judgment looks WICKED
     
  15. Erta Wanderer
    OldBlood

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    shame that his buff against 6 or less wound models is just on bights that would be even better
     
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  16. Captaniser
    Carnasaur

    Captaniser Well-Known Member

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    Isn't it on an unmodified hit that the d6 mortal wounds trigger? If not then i suppose it will get faq'ed if it cathes the attention of GW.
     
  17. Lizerd
    Skink Priest

    Lizerd Well-Known Member

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    To quote “6 Sword of Judgement:This sword judges those struck, destroying the unworthy. Pick one of the bearer’s melee weapons to be a Sword of Judgement. If the hit roll for an attack with that weapon against a HERO or MONSTER is a 6+, that attack inflicts d6 mortal wounds.”

    it doesn’t say unmodified so it’s in the clear, I’m going to check the errata
     
  18. Captaniser
    Carnasaur

    Captaniser Well-Known Member

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    The flamer has an attack characteristic of one (1), but it is ranged so it won't benefit from the command ability.
     
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  19. Lizerd
    Skink Priest

    Lizerd Well-Known Member

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    Alright, checked errata and sword of judgement is in the clear
     
  20. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    They have an attack characteristic on the new profile.

    But I thought it was for ranged weapons as well, or I mistook it for something else.
     
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  21. Nart
    Carnasaur

    Nart Well-Known Member

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    It was true before, but now now you just throw dice, when in range. They are not the number of attacks.

    Yeah, just noticed it. Shame, that Chief's CA works only on melee. But Salamanders would be broken otherwise.
     

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