Hi everyone!! So I had a great 2000pt game last night against Ogres playing the watch tower scenario. Have a read and please any comments or feedback would be greatly appreciated either tactically or on the writing of the report itself. So without further ado the lists: Lizards Slann (Lore of Beasts) Rumination Cogitation Loremaster Fencers blades Crown of command Cupped hands Scar vet BSB Burning Blade of Chotec Gamblers armor Dragon bane gem shield Saurus warriors (HW & Shield) x35 horde formation (BSB goes here) Saurus warriors (spears & shield) x30 5x6 formation Cohort x10 Cohort x10 Skirmishers x10 Skirmishers x10 Chamo Skinks x6 Baby Steg Ogres (what I know) Tyrant ASF sword 4++ ward Butcher 1 (knows Toothcracker and Trollguts) Lvl2 Channel staff Great weapon Butcher 2 (knows Bonecruncher and Bullgorger) Lvl2 Dispell scroll Ironfist Bruiser BSB Razor standard Ironfist 7 Ironguts (Butcher 1 and Tyrant go here) (3x3) Standard of Discipline 7 bulls (Butcher 2 and Bruiser goes here) (3x3) 9 bulls (3x3) Stonehorn So he won the role for who gets the watchtower (which was also a wizards tower) and deploys his unit of 9 bulls in it. There was plenty of terrain but none of it played a part really. I was surprised he didn’t put the Irongut unit with all his characters in it into the tower as that would have made it quite hard to shift. Looking at his army as he deployed I was confident I could control the battlefield as he had no chaff and his units were rather small. Having faced another ogre army several times I think units 4x3 are much more effective. I was also surprised that at least one of his wizards didn’t take the great maw sig spell which grants a unit stuborn. The scenario made me change my mind about where to put the combat Slann. Usually he goes in the horde but as I wanted them assaulting the tower I decided to hold him back and use him as support despite this being a waste of the crown and fencers blades. Deployment from my left to right Chamos---stone horn--Iron Guts-----------------------Bulls -------- --------------------------------------------------Tower---------------------- ---------------------Skink--Skink--Spear--HW& Shield---Steg------- --------------------Skink—Skink-------------Slann------------------------ Lizards Turn1 Predictably my saurus horde with the scar vet charges the ogres in the tower. All my skinks move up in a concave formation around the stonehorn with the two units of skink cohorts set up to redirect the Tyrants unit of Iron guts when they charge. My Spear saurus shuffle up a small bit to flank the Ironguts if they decide to go into the skinks. On the right hand side the the steg doesn’t move so I can try and shoot the BSB with the giant box. The slann stays in between the two saurus units but out of the way of any possible charges or over runs. Magic was decent, I got 9PD to 5DD. I try for a Wyssins Wildform on the unit assaulting the tower but he uses all of his dice to dispel it. Next I throw a Curse of Anrihir for the -1 to hit on his bulls in the tower and finish up with a boosted version of Amber spear at his Stonehorn. I wound it (barely!! I rolled a 2) and role a 6 for number of wounds!! However I learned that Stonehorns half the number of wounds they take from multiple wound damage but Im pretty happy with three wounds off that thing so early. All my skink shooting put another two wounds on the Stonehorn!! At this point I’d just like to say I role 6’s like a ninja this game!! For poison, for parry saves and for casting. The dice were definitely on my side this game. Skink cohorts also put two wounds on an Irongut. Giant bow missed entirely (cant get em all I suppose). In combat I decided not to send my scar vet into the tower. This was my first time running a scar vet BSB and I really didn’t want him getting killed. I also wanted to hold back revealing the Burning Blade until my opponent casted a troll guts on the unit. I could let him waste dice on that spell and cancel the rest of his magic phase and have the regen on the unit cancelled by the blade. So in go my 10 saurus warriors who beat up on the unit a bit, killed an ogre and wounded another I think. Didn’t take many casualties in return thanks to the Curse and I win combat. Now I learn his Ironguts unit has the Standard of Discipline so his Tyrant is Ld 10 and the BSB is in range so they pass no problem. I figure at this point I can either try and Savage beast my Scar vet and kill the tower unit to a man or try and Amber Spear his general (I don’t think he has a look out knoblar) and kill his BSB if I want to dislodge that unit from the tower. Ogres Turn 1 He charges my cohort unit and roles an 11 for charge distance so hits them no problem and gets the multiple impact hits but I kill an irongut from stand and shoot. Next turn his Stonehorn will probably scare away a lot of my skinks through terror as they are mostly out of range of the general which will collapse most of the chaff on my left flank but I’m not too worried as I expect the important stuff like to cohort unit angled in front of the Ironguts to hold as they are in Slann range. His Bulls on the right flank are also in position to charge my horde next turn but if they make it they will be flanked by the steg. His unit in the tower stays right where they are. Magic gets him a decent number of power dice but I becalm the wizard with troll guts and tooth cracker and all he gets off is a Bull gorger (+1 Str) on the bulls in the tower. The only shooting he has is the bear trap on the Stonehorn which targets a skink and misses (Hurrah!!) and there’s no combat. He kills the cohorts to the man and reforms Lizards Turn 2 My saurus horde charge the tower and do it at such an angle so the bulls on my right flank will hit them in the front and the skinks move to within short range of the stonehorn. I have a cohort blocking the Ironguts and skirmisher unit behind them to receive an overcharge and hold them in place. The spear saurus stay put and the Slann moves slightly to get good range on spells and leadership. The steg moves along my right flank to put him into a position to counter charge the bull unit if they get into my horde but far enough away that it’s a long shot if they go for the steg itself. Magic is 5PD to 4DD Ithrow 3 dice (2+Rumination) get an IF Wyssins off on my unit assaulting the tower. The miscast does a St6 hit to my Slann and I decide not Cupped Hands it. Slann fails his ward, takes a wound and I lose the rest of my PD. So no Amber Spear to the general or savage scar vet this turn. Shooting sees the Stonehorn brought down by the mighty Chamo Skinks and I kill two Ironguts from the rest of my skink shooting. Steg missed and the Iron guts pass their panic check. So this turn I decide to throw my Scar Vet into the tower as I need to start racking up kills. I issue a challenge and he accepts with his unit champ. Before the champ even gets to swing I put three wounds on him thanks to the Wyssans and the re rolls from the BBoC. The rest of my unit then beats up on the ogres killing a couple (I don’t really keep count cause the units not on the table to keep things easy) but he manages to kill off a few saurus too (I think there are still 30 left at this point). I win and they hold. Ogres Turn 2 He charges the right most bulls into the front of my horde which I think this is great because im going to put every attack I can on his BSB and hopefully kill him. He declares a charge with his Iron guts into my spear saurus trying to get around my cohort but the gap I left between the tower and the cohort is too small and he fails his charge which is just great for me. He gets a good role for magic but I becalm his troll guts/tooth cracker Butcher and gets +1 St onto his right most bulls which I fail to dispel and my Slann is done for that magic phase. He next goes for the the big troll guts and gets it no problem. He tries to cast Tooth Ctacker (+1T) onto the unit in the tower but fails his role thanks to Becalming and his phase is done. In combat he kills a few saurus warriors with impact hits but thanks to Wyssans still being up the worst of the damage is avoided I move my BSB into base contact with his BSB but in a way that his unit can’t get my BSB. He roles for his BSB first and wounds my Scar Vet once and I find out hes carrying the razor standard. This means two things, 1) my Scar vets save goes to a 6+/6+ and 2) he doesn’t have any magic gear or a ward save!! So he wounds the scar vet once and I roll a 6 for my armor save (crazy good luck). Scar Vet hits back and puts two wounds on his BSB. His unit strikes back and kill a few saurus, Wyssans offsetting his Str buff but I hit back and destroy his BSB and kill a few more ogres. He’s on snake eyes to hold and breaks. My unit restrains and reforms to face the building again and he flees 12inch. Lizards Turn 3 My horde charges the building again and my steg charges the fleeing bull unit pushing it further towards the board edge. I want to charge my spear saurus into his ironguts but I don’t think they’ll fit around the cohort and tower so I charge the skink cohort in first and then charge the saurus in. I move the skirmishers and chamos to behind the Ironguts so that if they flee and I cant catch them they’ll flee through my units and off the table. Maybe a little bit cheesey (?) but I need that Ld10 tyrant gone! Magic gives me 5PD to 3DD. I decide this is my opportunity to get rid of the tyrant so I want to buff the spear saurus instead of the horde. I get off a Curse of Anrihir onto the Ironguts with a high role (and his dispel scroll butcher is currently running away) and I get an irresistible Wyssans and role a 7 for the miscast so no problems. No shooting this turn as everything is out of range or in combat. Combat I actually do quite badly against the bulls in the tower, the scar vet doing one wound which manages to remove the regen but in the end I lose combat but don’t flee. Against the Ironguts I do a couple of wounds because he still has his regen but he does quite badly and with my charge and rank bonus I beat him and he needs a 4 to hold and he gets it!! Ogres Turn 3 His bulls fail to rally and keep fleeing but not too far and that’s the end of movement. His magic is totally shut down by my Slann. No shooting He kills a ton of skinks in combat really upping his combat res and goes to town on the spear saurus. I lose and the skinks break but the saurus are steadfast and hold. This is actually great for me as there are three of ten skinks left so they’ll probably rally and I can move my saurus over to get more, better attacks. Lizards Turn 4 My steg charges the bulls off the board and that’s all for movement. My Slann gets another curse and another IF Wyssans into the Ironguts vs Spear saurus combat. This time I get the small Str10 blast template on the miscast and throw it onto the Butcher in the Ironguts unit which kills two Iron guts and puts a wound on the Tyrant. This leaves that unit at the Butcher, Tyrant and Ironguts champion. That’ll do Slann, That’ll do. No shooting Again my saurus fail miserably and only manage one wound on the iron guts champion. They get beat up but are steadfast so hold. Again I attack the tower and realize theres only 4 guys left with one on one wound. Ogres Turn 4 Magic is a flop as my becalming makes him fail his troll guts spell. This turn my saurus get their act together and kill the Iron guts champion but his Tyrant is a beast and he wins combat and I hold. He roles to see if the game ends but it goes on!! Lizards Turn 5 I charge the tower. Steg moves round to charge the tyrant and butcher if this goes another turn. Magic sees me fail my first spell with a 1,1,1 His Butcher and Tyrant continue to kill saurus but cant break my steadfast, I have two and a half ranks left. My horde kills the tower ogres down to one man with two wounds left Ogres Turn 5 My saurus kill his butcher outright and break his tyrant who flees through my skinks off the board HUZZAH. But he still holds the watch tower… he rolls to see if the game ends….. a 2!!! The game continues but my opponent concedes as he has one ogre left in the tower. Victory to the lizardmen!!! So this was a really great game, we both had a lot of fun and hats off to my opponent for going till the very end. I was definitely very lucky but I think I played it right, stalling his Iron guts with my chaff and removing his support models. I think if I had focused on buffing my horde unit that was attacking the tower I may have killed everyone in there faster but that may have allowed the ironguts to get around my left flank and into my horde so buffing the spear saurus to hold them up and eventually kill them was important. I had a lot of wasted gear on my Slann this game, he normally runs with the horde and gets into the thick of things but once we rolled watch tower he was reassigned to a support role which he did well at. However had my opponent elected for me to start in the tower I think starting the slann in there would have been my best bet. The only unit I had less than 20 models in were the skink units and I think they would have been killed to a man if they started in the tower. A ws10 T4 W5 stubborn 4++ Slann would be difficult to move especially if I get him in challenges and get some savage beast or panns pelt off. This is just theory of course so I’d like to hear people’s thoughts on it. He only needs to last two rounds of combat till another unit arrives to garrison it.
Can Ogres put a unit of 20 in the tower? That would be crazy good for them if that's the case. I put 20 Skinks in a tower once. With the general and BSB nearby they managed to avoid dying or breaking from two assaults of Savage Orcs and a Warboss. I got Speed of Light on them once. With even stronger buffs (like Flesh to Stone) they should do even better. This bought me the time I needed to get my Temple Guard into the watchtower. I still lost but not because the Skinks failed me. Also, do Beasts Slann really need Loremaster. The best spell is the signature spell and the Transformation of Kadon is useless to Slann. That'd be a good way to save 50 points for other things.
Thanks for a thrilling battle report! And as Ogres get no love from me, big congrats on the victory! You say that his mage who had the Dispel Scroll couldn't use it as he was running. Now I'm not 100% sure about this, but I think that mages can use their magic items even if they are fleeing. It's in the FAQ file, if I'm not mistaken. I have no experiences on putting a lone Slann to the Watchtower, but I think that in theory it could work. It's a big risk, though.
Only infantry can start in the Watchtower. Ogres aren't infantry. @Caprisauridae: As of FAQ 1.6, dispelling or using items while fleeing is no longer allowed. It was pointed out on another forum that they changed that FAQ reply without colouring the text.
So Gnoblars is the only thing they can start with? Ouch. I guess if I can hold a tower with 20 Skinks 20 Gnoblars might do okay. Especially if they make all attackers make a dangerous terrain test each charge.
Hey guys thanks for the comments! Yeah we knew ogres couldn't start in the tower but it was a fun friendly game so we said they could and he was nice enough to just put a regular unit of 9 in there without characters. I think lore of beasts is great and not just for the sig spell, spear and curse are both really useful and I'm happy to spend the 50 pts to garuntee I get them. It's funny, the guy I played also uses Lizzies and it totally threw him through a loop that I didn't take light life or shadow. He was respecting beasts by the end of it though