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8th Ed. A new Lizard!

Discussion in 'Lizardmen & Saurian Ancients Army Lists' started by Phaeron, Sep 14, 2022.

  1. airjamy
    Troglodon

    airjamy Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like you are making pretty nice expansions? Is your local area competitive, or is it more casual? We have not discussed our strongest boy yet, the Cowboy ;)
     
  2. BrotherSutek
    Chameleon Skink

    BrotherSutek Well-Known Member

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    The Cowboy is an amazing unit and one of my favorites as well. So flexible and useful.
     
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  3. Phaeron
    Skink

    Phaeron Member

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    My local meta is not yet defined, I think. Just some guys who are starting with fantasy again! But my main opponent has already started out with high elves, dwarfs and chaos !

    I played Orcs and Goblins back when fantasy was still supported, and still have a big army in my attic. But ever since I read the little lustria booklet (came with a white dwarf) I wanted lizardmen!

    Now I ordered a built Stegadon on ebay for cheap
    Sadly no option to make it an ancient, but I surely will get a second one!

    And what is the cowboy?
     
  4. BrotherSutek
    Chameleon Skink

    BrotherSutek Well-Known Member

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    A hero on a cold one. They are amazing value for what they cost. So many uses and so flexible while also being a decent beat stick.
     
  5. airjamy
    Troglodon

    airjamy Well-Known Member

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    What Brother Sutek said. You take a Scarvet, put him on a Cold One, and give him a Great Weapon. This gives him 4 attacks with Predatory Figther at S7, so he hits like a truck. Yes always strikes last, but he has low I anyway and with his defensive gear he is very unlikely to die.

    There are 2 main builds. The first and best one IMHO is a Cold One for speed, a Dawnstone, the Gamblers Armor and a GW. This gives him the offensive output i already mentioned, but also a 1+ armor save (5+ from scaly skin, 3+ from being on a Cold One (thick skinned) and 1+ from heavy armor). With the Dawnstone you can reroll failed armor saves, so even against S4 attacks you have a 2+ rerollable save. This makes him basically invulnerable to anything S4 or less, and even S5/S6 will have some issues taking him down. The 6++ is also nice. This also lets him stand in the open quite nicely, because most bowfire/crossbowfire will do nothing against him. Gotta be careful against Bolt Throwers or Cannons tho! Lore of Life healing him with the Lore Attribute is also strong in a pinch. He just does a lot of damage, is very cheap (like 140 points in this setup), is easy to hide, fast, perfect damage dealer and problem solver. Smashes all other chaff into the dust, things like Illyrian Reavers or Dark Riders hate him, and he can even take down monsters, especially if the monsters are only S4/S5. Do not forget they do not get Thunderstomp against him, as he is Cav. :)

    The other build is the same regarding the GW and Cold One but goes Armor of Destiny for a 1+ save with a 4++ ward. Makes him less impervious against S3/4, but better against things at S5 and better. I like both builds, they are basically meta calls, but it is also nice to have at least something against Bolt Throwers and the like. He does not need a bodyguard which is very strong, he can just run solo.

    I have seen some other builds, with like Dawnstone and Armor of Destiny on an Oldblood for example, or Glittering Scales/Fencers blades, but nothing beats 2 Scarvets IMHO. I think 2 strong and cheap threats are better than the one extra wound and attack the Oldblood offers you. Every full comp list should run the Dawnstone and Armor of Destiny scarvet IMHO, they rock.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2022
  6. Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl
    Slann

    Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl Eleventh Spawning

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    Welcome @Phaeron to the jungle! Judging by the profile name, are you also a Necron player in 40K?

    Anyway, glad to hear you're getting back into Warhammer Fantasy again, and I like the look of your all-rounder list so far. I would personally maintain that Saurus make a solid backbone for the core of a Lizard army, decent melee fighters that can overpower a lot of enemy Core choices, and capable of being taken in sufficiently large numbers to weather shooting casualties.

    And there's no need to feel ashamed of your other armies, for we have threads to discuss them too! Our resident Ogre Tyrant @Lizards of Renown has started his own thread for followers of the Great Maw: https://www.lustria-online.com/threads/any-ogre-players-on-the-forum.25242/

    A fledgling Greenskins thread has started to grow here: https://www.lustria-online.com/threads/da-orcs-and-gobbos-thread-wauuugh.26732/

    And I am the head of the mighty Coven of Lustrian Beastlords! By stating your part-allegiance to the True Children of Chaos, you've earned yourself a place in the Coven! Head over to this thread to discuss all things Beast: https://www.lustria-online.com/threads/the-ultimate-beastmen-thread.26457/

    And you've arrived just in time, because I have unleashed Version 1.1 of my 8th Edition Beastman army book upon the world! As GW never gave us one :shifty:, I have taken it upon myself to pen my own version! Currently I am in the process of gaining feedback from other Beastlords round about to make sure it is not too strong or too weak, so I'd love to hear your thoughts!

    @NIGHTBRINGER I think it's time you introduced our newest Fantasy acolyte to your Index of Armies and Members who play them!
     
  7. Phaeron
    Skink

    Phaeron Member

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    Thanks a lot! Yes, I have a Necron army for 40k - but Kor Phaeron is one of the Arch Traitors of the Word Bearers Legion in Horus Heresy. And the Heresy is my current SciFi-Project because the Story is so damn cool! So I think I am mutating to a "old system" player with Warhammer Fantasy and Horus Heresy (which is technically an improved version of the 7th Edition 40k) - but I like it that way!
    Warhammer Fantasy was on display in a Hobby store in my Hometown (Hamburg in Germany) when I was a Kid, and I think I visited this store a lot of times just to stand there and watch this great diorama (It was a biiiiiig battle between Chaos Warriors, the Hunchback Versions, and the Empire).

    After that I played a bit of WHFB with the release of the 6th Edition Starter Set (Origin of my Orks and Goblins), but with joining the military in 2005 I had to take a break until 2012, when I met some other Soldiers who are playing Wargames as well. Now after many years, whe came back to where it all started - WHFB!

    I will build a cool ScarVet on Cold one from one of the Cold one Knights from my boxes (I think there are some Bits on the Sprue for the Carnosaur to make one), and hopefully I can test the "Cowboy" on Saturday against some High Elves! Hopefully he, a Skink Priest with Lore of the Beasts, 20 Saurus with Shields and Handweapons, 15 Temple Guard and a Stegadon will hold their ground!

    I will take a look at the Beastmen Book! Sounds awesome, especially since the "official" army book for them seems a bit lacking. And as much as I like to play the game for fun, I don't like being on the receiving end of the heavy blows all the time! :-D

    My Ogres are currently getting new bases, I have taken them off their old Squares and put them on the round bases, but never played Age of Sigmar with them. So now I am 3d printing Square bases and glue them back on familiar ground :) And hell, they look just awesome on a Square base!
     
  8. Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl
    Slann

    Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl Eleventh Spawning

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    You're not alone there, I have stuck to the old systems I used to play back when they were supported (7th-8th Edition Fantasy and 5th-6th Edition 40K) because of a combination of not being hugely fond of 7th and 8th 40K and 1st Edition AoS and simply not being bothered to get into the more appealing 9th Edition 40K and 2nd Edition AoS because of the unnecessary 'compulsory' scenario books and the time being too short between edition updates.

    Sounds like a solid starter list, all those Strength 4 and up attacks will make combat pretty easy for you against most Toughness 3 Elves, and the Steg will bring the thing Elves hate most - Impact Hits! Though beware of Swordmasters and White Lions, their ability to strike at their standard Initiative with Great Weapons is nasty, so you'll need to make use of your Bolt Thrower and spells like The Curse of Anraheir and The Amber Spear to soften them up a bit before engaging, preferably with your Impact Hit-dealing Steg!

    The Curse of Anraheir
    is also a great way to bypass a particularly notorious Magic Item of theirs, the Banner of the World Dragon - normally that banner gives the High Elf unit in question a 2+ Ward against magical attacks, effectively rendering them immune to spells, but The Curse of Anraheir forces the unit to take Dangerous Terrain tests if it moves. Because Dangerous Terrain tests are not Magical Attacks, the Banner is useless against that spell!

    Certainly the 7th Edition Beastman book saw a drop in power level when 8th came about, particularly when other armies received their 8th books and became even stronger, so I aim to give our Beasty Boys a similar boost to level the playing field! I don't know if you ever managed to play them with their 6th Edition book when you first started? Because if so you're in for a treat, because a good few of the rules in that book, that were ditched or nerfed in the 7th one, are making a comeback!

    You didn't keep the old square bases you took them off from? Never mind, 3d-Printed ones will work equally as well.

    I do agree they certainly look more the part on squares! I've always innately viewed round bases as '40K bases', so to see Fantasy models on rounds when used in AoS seems jarring! Square bases certainly look great when the models are formed into units and the bases become so pleasingly flush with one another.
     
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  9. Lizards of Renown
    Slann

    Lizards of Renown Herald of Creation

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    It's okay my friend, there is always time to come back from the Dark Side ;)
     
  10. Phaeron
    Skink

    Phaeron Member

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    Yeah I think so, too! I like to play AoS, really. But I have my Bonereaper Legion to play, and they fit in nicely. So all the other, older models that used to be WHFB will be converted back to square bases. And if I really want to play AoS with them - okay, I can print some nice adapter for them. But they were made to be fielded in regiments and tight blocks, and I want to do exactly that with them

    Sadly I can't play my lizardmen tomorrow against the elves (or Dwarfs, I don't know), since I was not able to fully build and at least base paint my army. But the Dinosaurs will get their time to play, I think in the coming weeks!

    So tomorrow my Butcher, 13 ogre bulls, 4 Leadbelcher and an Ironblaster will have to hold their ground!
     
  11. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    @Phaeron

    Lustria Online has an excellent sub-forum dedicated to the rest of the armies of 8th edition Warhammer. Come check out the Other Armies Discussion . There are a whole bunch of great threads in there, on a very wide range of topics. If you see one you like, don't hesitate to resurrect the discussion with a new post. Or start a new topic yourself! :)

    While you're there, you can also have your name added to the WFB armies and the forum members who play them index. Just drop a post into the thread with all the non-Lizardmen armies you play and I'll add you onto the list. It's a good place to find forum members who play the armies you're interested in (or the armies you'll be facing).


    Join the party!
     
  12. Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl
    Slann

    Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl Eleventh Spawning

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    [​IMG]
     
  13. Phaeron
    Skink

    Phaeron Member

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    Done! :-D

    So, now I am building my first unit of Templeguard! Great models! All of the Lizardmen. I am looking forward to try out some of the Contrast paints on them - or maybe even the Greenstuffworld inks!

    Next week I will be playing my first games for sure. I am absolutely hyped for their gameplay and all those stunning models

    The models of the Scar Veteran on Foot and the Eternity Warden are waiting at home, are they viable too? Especially the Eternity Warden seems like he is very resilent.
     
  14. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    While not as popular as the Scar-Veteran Cowboy, the unmounted version is still a viable choice in a unit of Saurus Warriors or Temple Guard. Like most others, I'm a huge fan of the cowboy, but you can make the Scar-Veteran on foot work.

    In terms of the special character Chakax, the Eternity Warden, he is unfortunately one of the most overcosted heroes in the game. In my opinion he has no place in a competitive list. He simply costs way too many points... as much as many lord level characters. However, he is a great model and can easily be used instead as a Scar-Veteran or Oldblood.

    I feel that only three of our special characters are cost effective: Tetto'eko, Lord Kroak and Gor-rok. Every other one is either underpowered or overcosted.
     
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  15. airjamy
    Troglodon

    airjamy Well-Known Member

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    Gor Rok as well? Have never really ran him, i just look at him and i am like, but my cowboy is faster and stronger. I guess T6 really has its advantages? Chakax is indeed sadly pretty bad. His whole ability to see hidden stuff is also very easily played around.

    Also new profile pic NIGHTBRINGER? :O Nice!
     
  16. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    I still think that the Cowboy is the more competitive build, but Gor-Rok has his uses. He is still a fair value for his points, it's just that the Cowboy is undercosted.

    Gor-Rok is an alternative source for Stubborn, making the Saurus unit he leads very tough to shift. If you wanted to build an ultra heavy Saurus list, Gor-Rok's inclusion gives you the ability to field 3 nearly unbreakable stubborn units. Toughness 6 is a great at keeping him alive. Additionally, his ability to re-roll failed To Hit rolls works synergistically with his ability to generate Predatory Fighter attacks on 5's and 6's. With decent dice rolling he can generate and land a significant number of hits on the enemy. At S5, he won't be the best at facing heavily armoured or high toughness enemies, but against softer (but more numerous) targets he can really shine.

    At the end of the day, the Cowboy is still the more competitive choice. I place the Cowboy in our top five competitive choices (in no particular order):
    • Cowboy
    • Skink Skirmishers
    • Salamanders
    • Slann
    • Tetto'eko
    Thank you! I painted it a while back and decided to shake things up. :)
     
  17. Phaeron
    Skink

    Phaeron Member

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    So okay.... Dwarfs are a hard nut to crack! Running against a defensive gun line is no fun.
    My saurus warriors got decimated on the way to their target and got stuck in a unit of 10 ironbreaker with shield after they killed 10 musketeers. Magic had no real effect sadly. And my Stegadon shot a cannon and killed 15 clanwarriors.

    I definitely have to practice more!
     
  18. airjamy
    Troglodon

    airjamy Well-Known Member

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    What did he run? Generally Dwarven gunlines are an ok matchup, Lore of Metal does really well for us normally there against things like Ironbreakers, as do Skinks with poison if you can get them to shoot the artillery pieces.
     
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  19. Phaeron
    Skink

    Phaeron Member

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    Yeah I had no access to Lore of Metal or fire, I can't fit a Slann in a 1000 point army list
    But the Skinks did okay against the Ironbreaker. My bigger saurus block was sadly shot to death before doing anything. Irondrakes, thunderers and a cannon gave them all they had
     
  20. Phaeron
    Skink

    Phaeron Member

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    Oh and what did he run - it was
    1 Thain
    1 canon
    10 irondrakes
    10 ironbreaker
    10 thunderer
    And some dwarf warriors

    We were just playing 1000 points.
    While getting in range for a charge my block of 20 saurus got shot badly.
     
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