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AoS Draco Tail 2k fun but optimized list advice needed

Discussion in 'Seraphon Army Lists' started by Tilorn91, Jan 16, 2022.

  1. Tilorn91
    Saurus

    Tilorn91 Active Member

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    Hello everyone! After maybe 6 months of a pause, I am looking to get back into playing this, to me, wonderfully fun game. There is a new gaming club opening up and they are starting a league type thing with weekly matches and a group stage followed by play-offs, and I want to join in. The last league that was organized I ended up winning, and I am hoping for the same result here, though with a less optimized list.

    Where last time I went full on with Skink Chief TL double tapping the Engine / Basti, this time around I am looking for maybe some more casting and summoning. The models in the list I use rarely, and I want to have them on the table for a change. I am aware that this is probably not as potent of a list as some of the others, as it actually has 0 salamanders, but it is just a matter of trying to squeeze out as much as I can from something slightly sub-par.

    Allegiance: Seraphon
    - Constellation: Dracothion's Tail
    - Mortal Realm: Ghur
    - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery
    - Triumphs: Inspired

    Leaders
    Engine of the Gods (265)*
    - Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
    Lord Kroak (430)**
    Saurus Astrolith Bearer (150)**
    Slann Starmaster (265)
    - General
    - Command Trait: Ancient Knowledge
    - Artefact: Itxi Grubs
    - Ancient Knowledge 2nd Spell: Celestial Apotheosis
    - Spell: Celestial Equilibrium
    Skink Oracle on Troglodon (270)*
    - Artefact: Godbeast Pendant
    - Mount Trait: Starborne
    - Spell: Fiery Convocation

    Battleline
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)***
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)***

    Behemoths
    Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)*

    Core Battalions
    *Alpha-Beast Pack
    **Warlord
    ***Hunters of the Heartlands

    Total: 1975 / 2000
    Reinforced Units: 0 / 4
    Allies: 0 / 400
    Wounds: 93
    Drops: 9

    So the idea is as follows. Troglodon will be a huge distraction on one side of the table, regenerating and healing from up to 5d3 per turn from Regen, Hero Action, EotG, Slann Spell, and prayer. On top of that, when he finally goes down, he is back fully on a 4+. Also, he can channel Kroak spells if need be. He will be to one side with the Engine, and hopefully tank a lot.

    On the other side of the table I'd have the standard setup of two frogs and an Astrolith for some good old fashioned +4 to casting from the AB and Slann spell, pushing the new beautiful Kroak forward with 30 extra wounds on the Guard to hold the other side of the field.

    Now, my question is this, is there more potency to squeeze out of a list like this? Maybe curse instead of heal? Maybe different spells? Maybe something instead of the Basti, as I find that in this subfaction, he goes down rather quick regardless of his 1+ armor save, with some meh shooting as I don't even have a Skink Priest to give him +1 to hits, nor the really nice TL CA for double activation.

    All in all, thanks for taking the time to read my stream of consciousness, and while I don' t really hope for groundbreaking advice here, maybe there is something I am missing. The grubs are, to me, the best artifact we have as the Slann can reroll two casts / unbinds and heal reliably, the pregame move of our monsters also helps with adjustments based on what I am up against, and since I have a lot of drops I will usually go first since others will hope for a double turn most likely.

    Also, what about the summoning? This has the potential of doing 5d3 points per turn, though I believe it is too much of a gamble saving up for anything other than a flood of skinks. The bodies for objectives, and the screen + teleport capability seems to be too valuable to wait for something like a Carno, or even a salamander or two?
     
  2. Schneelachs
    Skink

    Schneelachs Member

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    Hey,

    first of all nice to see a list a bit different. But without sallies your just to short on output.

    For fun this list will work and some other armys will struggle.

    But the actual Meta list will just destroy this version easy.

    Your not able to Kill a Giant.
    SC Dragons are a horror for you with the 4+ spell ignore.

    Without a propper deepstrike damage unit also all shooting armys will have an easy time.
    Sentinels, kruelboys or longstrikes will stay untouched.

    If you will stay with this version, Ii would absolut drop one guard for skinks and add cromatic cogs for more casting power :)
    So you can also add burning head for more mortal output :)

    Greets
     
  3. Tilorn91
    Saurus

    Tilorn91 Active Member

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    Yeah I agree with everything you said pretty much. Thankfully, there are no SoB's in the league, though there are 16 participants with various potent armies. Two SCE's, and one is bound to run the dragons in their full glory, there is one Kruleboi too. What can I trim to make space for at least two Sallies? I really feel the Basti is not that strong, and pretty much all the heroes are more or less mandatory for all of it to work. Maybe the EotG can go? Though his prayer, potential summoning / healing and ok-ish damage is of more value. I'd also like to squeeze in a Skink Priest, but the points are really a struggle.
     
  4. Schneelachs
    Skink

    Schneelachs Member

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    Allegiance: Seraphon
    Constellation: Dracothion's Tail
    Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery

    LEADERS
    Troglodon (270)* - Artefact: Godbeast Pendant
    Engine of the Gods (265) - Artefact: Incandescent Rectrices
    Slann Starmaster (265)* - General - Command Trait: Ancient Knowledge - Ancient Knowledge 2nd Spell: Stellar Tempest
    Astrolith (150)
    Skink Priest (80)*
    UNITS
    2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)*
    2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)
    1 x Salamander Hunting Pack (140)
    10 x Skinks (75)
    10 x Skinks (75)
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)

    CORE BATTALIONS *Warlord **Battle Regiment TOTAL: 1995 /2000
    Drops 5

    This is what Iam testing right now. I know no Kroak but I realy did not manage to finde a propper list for him ;)

    OK it looks stupid but hear me out ;)

    EOTG and Troglodon have the two ARTEFACTS (one spezial for DT and one the regular one) for coming back or call it secound life. So on average you will get one dice for good.

    Those Monsters will Tank forever ( also u can force heal by rolling 2 dice) and Sallies will do the range ;)

    Also you can drop the prist to upgrate 10 Skinks to 10 guard and play Cogs^^
     
  5. Tilorn91
    Saurus

    Tilorn91 Active Member

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    That is, for sure, a more potent list in terms of damage, and the double 4+ resurrect will also be nice! In the end, I changed mine up a bit, dropping the Basti all together to give this concept a fair shot. I really am not looking for a good run in terms of wins, but I really want to give Kroak + Trog combo a fair shot with plenty of screens and Guard. A fantasy I had for a long time to had a true fortress of magic damage and Temple Guard (sadly renamed now, I know...)


    Allegiance: Seraphon
    - Constellation: Dracothion's Tail
    - Mortal Realm: Ghur
    - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery
    - Triumphs: Inspired

    Leaders
    Engine of the Gods (265)*
    - Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
    - Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
    Lord Kroak (430)***
    Saurus Astrolith Bearer (150)***
    Skink Oracle on Troglodon (270)*
    - Artefact: Godbeast Pendant
    - Mount Trait: Starborne
    - Spell: Fiery Convocation
    Slann Starmaster (265)***
    - General
    - Command Trait: Ancient Knowledge
    - Ancient Knowledge 2nd Spell: Celestial Apotheosis
    - Spell: Celestial Equilibrium
    Skink Priest (80)***
    - Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal

    Battleline
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
    10 x Skinks (75)***
    - Boltspitters Celestite Daggers & Star Bucklers
    10 x Skinks (75)***
    - Boltspitters Celestite Daggers & Star Bucklers

    Endless Spells & Invocations
    Chronomantic Cogs (45)

    Core Battalions
    *Alpha-Beast Pack
    **Hunters of the Heartlands
    ***Warlord

    Additional Enhancements
    Artefact

    Total: 2000 / 2000
    Reinforced Units: 0 / 4
    Allies: 0 / 400
    Wounds: 107
    Drops: 11
     
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  6. Tombomb7
    Cold One

    Tombomb7 Well-Known Member

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    Let us know how it works out! I'm dying to try the Trog and Kroak good luck!
     
  7. Putzfrau
    Skar-Veteran

    Putzfrau Well-Known Member

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    IMO the second slann is an easy model to drop to free up some points for a little more output. I think the core of kroak + trog can work well, but the engine and second slann really start to eat into points that really should be going towards output.

    Give it a couple games before you change anything else, it might work great for your meta :)
     
  8. Tilorn91
    Saurus

    Tilorn91 Active Member

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    The league format is rather forgiving. 4 people in 4 groups, two from each move into eliminations. You turn in a list at the start, and you can only change it if you lose a game. So, if I get rolled, I will either edit it further, or give up on the concept. I already did a league with a sweaty Basti / Chief TL list, looking for something different with this hehe.

    As for the Slann drop, my logic is that I need a general for the free CCP, and the general trait is rather good on him, to reroll the spell for +1 on casting for others, and to have a wizard cast Cogs or something. But yeah, the point tax is massive for all these models, and I will not pretend the list is competitive or powerful, for it is most certainly not. Regardless, the idea is to give it a fair shot, and I will post when I get a game or two in, the league starts this weekend and each round takes two weeks, so it will be rather slow.

    The hope is to get a Sally summon per turn and hope for the best, or maybe warp in some screens and just outlast my opponents from Kroak 3xd3 MW spam around him or the distraction Trog that will hopefully not let me down on the 4+ resurrect.
     
  9. Schneelachs
    Skink

    Schneelachs Member

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    Hey Mate,

    I testet a List on the weekend thats maybe something for you ;)

    Allegiance: Seraphon - Constellation: Dracothion's Tail - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery

    LEADERS
    Lord Kroak (430)
    Saurus Astrolith Bearer (150)
    Slann Starmaster (265) - General - Command Trait: Ancient Knowledge
    Skink Oracle on Troglodon (270) - Artefact: Godbeast Pendant - Mount Trait: Starborne

    UNITS
    10 x Skinks (75) - Boltspitters Celestite Daggers & Star Bucklers
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)
    2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)
    2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)

    TOTAL: 1980/2000 WOUNDS: 95 REINFORCED UNITS: 2/4 DROPS:2

    You do on average 10 CP a round whats = 1 Salamander
    Kroak can cast on +5 and Ban +4 with support of the Slann.
    Also you have the pssibility vs hordes to give the Oracle also the horde killer spell.

    You can EOTG for Trog to have an One Drop, but a Salli a turn is to good I think.

    Greets
     
  10. Putzfrau
    Skar-Veteran

    Putzfrau Well-Known Member

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    IMO not having a skink priest is rough. Such a strong buff piece. I'm never really a fan of double slann just because you pretty quickly run out of meaningful spells to cast, but definitely give it a try and let us know how it goes! Summoning a salamander a turn definitely has a lot of potential.
     
  11. Schneelachs
    Skink

    Schneelachs Member

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    May This List is more for you.

    It gives DT a tanky unit that can hold a position on the field for longer.

    Maybe change EOTG for Oracle.

    LEADERS
    Saurus Astrolith Bearer (150)
    Slann Starmaster (265) - General - Command Trait: Ancient Knowledge
    Skink Oracle on Troglodon (270) - Artefact: Godbeast Pendant - Mount Trait: Starborne
    Priest (80)

    UNITS
    10 x Skinks (75) - Boltspitters Celestite Daggers & Star Bucklers
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)
    5 x Saurus Guard (115)
    2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)
    2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)

    ALLI
    2x Stormdrake Guard (340)

    TOTAL: 1970/2000 DROPS:2
     
  12. Putzfrau
    Skar-Veteran

    Putzfrau Well-Known Member

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    I think the trog really helps support Kroak and doesn't (unfortunately) add a ton to a regular slann. Just turning the trog into 2 more sallies is probably the best (or close to best) version of DT right now but there's a lot of flex in what you wanna do.

    Think it just depends if theres any core units you really want in the list. Do you wanna run kroak/trog? Drakes? Double slann? I'd figure that out and then just build up from there. Seraphon is in such a strong place right now that its really hard to go wrong, and i think its always better to run a list you feel good about/works with your style.

    I wouldn't let my feedback dissuade you from. your original list, just my personal, anecdotal experience :)
     
  13. Tilorn91
    Saurus

    Tilorn91 Active Member

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    The first match is in 10 hours, late afternoon, versus a Soulblight player that leans heavily into strong heroes and ambushing units, on Tectonic Interference scenario. Hoping for a win, but could be tough, will let you guys know how it went! As far as lists go, I am quite unhappy when I realized my list is illegal since Alpha-Beast Pack can't have Leader Behemoths, only non Leaders. So the already weaker list is also poorly made to not maximize battalions, sad times.

    Also a bit at a loss of what to summon. Sure I'd like a Sally more than 10 skinks, but can I survive being that greedy? Screens are premium.
     
  14. Tilorn91
    Saurus

    Tilorn91 Active Member

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    So, a bit of an update after the first match. I did the castle formation, the Soulblight player chose to go first and try and punch through the screens and potentially kill Kroak or some other key piece. His Prince on Zombie Dragon under-rolled heavily, killing maybe 3 guards from wound transfer. Then I got the bottom of turn one, did my casting, double turned, and finished off 3 of his heroes with a 2nd volley of magic phase. Gotta say that it feels good to be the arcane powerhouse, but the lack of damage in any other form is a big problem.

    EotG and Trog charged 10 skeletons and failed to kill them. 500+ points. Failed to do 10 wounds. Finest hour and all that too. Painful stuff, but the number of screens and mortals form spells is hefty, but the constant fear of misscasting and 5 spells going to waste is truly a constant. Time will tell if I have luck with future scenarios where my list will perform well, or not. More to come in two weeks for the 2nd round of games!

    The other two players in the group are a SCE player with Annihilators spam, which I think I will mop up easily as they will drop down, spread their mortals, charge and kill the remaining skinks, then I will remove them with spells. Or that is the plan. The other guy runs 3 Stonehorns, and that is... Gonna be impossible with a 3+ 5++ on all three of them. So a strong 2-1 prediction from the group to move forward to the play-off.

    All in all, a wildly different list from what I usually run, and I gotta say it is a fun time!
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2022
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  15. Schneelachs
    Skink

    Schneelachs Member

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    Ok thats crazy, I nearly predicted Ridge Las Vegas 4:1 List ;)
     
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