1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

AoS Let's talk about nerfs and buffs from 3.0

Discussion in 'Seraphon Discussion' started by The Tipsy Dragon, Jun 16, 2021.

  1. Carnikang
    Carnasaur

    Carnikang Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,301
    Likes Received:
    3,646
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I think the only ones who believe it's been destroyed were riding the high of the first tome.

    There are legitimate gripes to be had with it though. I will say that I feel for my local Slanneshie player who wants to make them work competitively.
     
  2. Erta Wanderer
    Skink Priest

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,904
    Likes Received:
    8,914
    Trophy Points:
    113
    no it's the loss of battalions that did that
     
  3. Dread Saurian
    Bastiladon

    Dread Saurian Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    798
    Likes Received:
    1,297
    Trophy Points:
    93
    images (11).jpeg making out like a bandit through the first discussion of points that gw talks about
     
    Nart likes this.
  4. Womboski
    Temple Guard

    Womboski Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    450
    Trophy Points:
    63
    They mentioned in the article doing 5point changes at a time so maybe we will see more frequent but minor changes to cost of units.
     
  5. Tyranitar
    Ripperdactil

    Tyranitar Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    832
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gotta love the 5 point change to Nagash, that level of perfect testing and tuning is a master class in game balance :p
     
    Killer Angel, Carnikang and Womboski like this.
  6. Womboski
    Temple Guard

    Womboski Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    450
    Trophy Points:
    63
    But what if a month or so from now you see across the board various units getting tweaked by 5pts and then then next couple months the same happens. No clue what pace they are going to set for point changes but with their "system" and talk it sounds like they are more open to that

    Perfect balance is nice in theory but gets stale if you play that forever. You will know who is going to win before the game starts based of this "perfect" balance. At least with changing things up either by changes like 3.0 or just 5pt tweaks across the board it's good to keep the meta from getting too stale
     
    Tyranitar and Erta Wanderer like this.
  7. Erta Wanderer
    Skink Priest

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,904
    Likes Received:
    8,914
    Trophy Points:
    113
    i think we can asume it will be the same pace as always twice a year

    tell that to chess
     
  8. Christopher
    Terradon

    Christopher Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    530
    Likes Received:
    851
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I wish I knew how to paste in that GIF of Orson Welles giving the standing ovation at the opera in Citizen Kane.
     
    Carnikang and Erta Wanderer like this.
  9. xoid
    Terradon

    xoid Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    542
    Likes Received:
    996
    Trophy Points:
    93
    So the mention of chess has me thinking, is there a game that could be considered perfectly balanced where the two sides aren't working with exactly the same tools? I can't come up with one, at least right now.
     
  10. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

    Messages:
    10,585
    Likes Received:
    23,274
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The first Starcraft?
     
  11. ArtoriusaurusRex
    Temple Guard

    ArtoriusaurusRex Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    225
    Likes Received:
    540
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Mmm...if there's any game where balancing whining was more of a pastime than Warhammer, it was Starcraft, lol

    Even old Starcraft.
     
  12. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

    Messages:
    6,156
    Likes Received:
    9,470
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No it doesn't. The only reason people keep thinking that is due to modern (video)games obsessivly implementing rock-paper-scissor-type balance with hard-counters.

    Step away from the constant hard-counters (and preferably from the obsessive rock-paper-scissor approach that "balances" out over an entire tournament but results in wildly unbalanced individual matches) and you'l get something that's balanced without it being stale.
     
    Dread Saurian likes this.
  13. Dread Saurian
    Bastiladon

    Dread Saurian Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    798
    Likes Received:
    1,297
    Trophy Points:
    93
    exactly it can be fun to get steamrolled my buddy sam and i laughed comedically for about 5 minutes when my girlfriend double turn tabled my buddys big waghhh it was hideously funny
     
    Canas likes this.
  14. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

    Messages:
    10,585
    Likes Received:
    23,274
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I disagree.
    Especially Brood War was a nice balanced game.
    The fact that you can just build the units you need, lets you fix things during the game. With gw games you cannot, and that alone makes the games more balanced.
    It's the core concept of real time strategy games
     
  15. Nart
    Carnasaur

    Nart Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,381
    Likes Received:
    2,773
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Whites' winrate is higher!
     
  16. VVolfsong
    Skink

    VVolfsong Active Member

    Messages:
    49
    Likes Received:
    131
    Trophy Points:
    33
    I can't see them ever revealing the details of that formula, but it would have been interesting to get a closer look at it. I've found myself wishing for separate point costs for Coalesced several times since our book was released, and reading that article only made that wish stronger.
     
    Tyranitar, xoid and Canas like this.
  17. Tyranitar
    Ripperdactil

    Tyranitar Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    832
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I agree 100%. Starborne and coalesced are so different and value our units so differently that it's impossible that every unit could have one point value that's balanced for both. It would save a lot of whining online as well if skinks were 1-2 pts more in starborne armies for example. And saurus units could be less in starborne
     
    ChapterAquila92 and Canas like this.
  18. Christopher
    Terradon

    Christopher Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    530
    Likes Received:
    851
    Trophy Points:
    93
    This sounds imminently sensible to me. But, speaking as someone who knows next to nothing about other factions, would that mean that subsections in other armies would require (or want) similar points granularity?
     
    Tyranitar and Canas like this.
  19. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

    Messages:
    6,156
    Likes Received:
    9,470
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Our subfactions differ more than the subfactions for other factions, noone else as a mechanic as powerfull as summoning and teleporting tied to subfactions, those are generally main-faction abilities.

    Though it's not something that's generally needed, though I can imagine there might be some others that would benefit from this approach.
     
  20. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

    Messages:
    6,156
    Likes Received:
    9,470
    Trophy Points:
    113
    GW apparently doesn't know the difference between a skink priest and a starpriest:

    upload_2021-7-1_15-34-15.png
     
    Tobi131313, Womboski, Skained and 4 others like this.

Share This Page