As we all know lord kroak got a new model and a gunned up warscroll, but also an increase in his footprint and cost. While he may have a frightening mortal wound output and a gorgeous model, I have to ask is he worth running with his necessary supports (saurus guard and astrolith)? On a side note as well, if he can make his points back what sub faction would you run him in, and what additional support is worth it? Like another carnosaur
He's one of those caster models like Kairos or Nagash that some bad RNG basically makes your 430 pt investment useless. If you roll double ones on his first cast he can't do anything the rest of the hero phase, that point sink would have been better on say a skink chief on steg that has tons of melee power and can even shoot. Granted that doesn't always happen, but I'm finding a lot more success with a Slann with the Arcane Might command trait, prevents the chance of a miscast pretty reliably. In terms of competitive lists, the only real nasty thing I've ran with kroak that works well is a Fangs of Sotek double skink cloud list, two units of thirty skinks with buffs from priests and starpriests supported by kroak and a slann with the astrolith buffing casting gets some serious magic done. that alpha strike list will run right some shoot things to hell and then you can summon on the back line and start getting skink speed bumps or salamanders and teleporting them behind enemy lines. That list is fragile tho since it's so dependent on rng. The thunderlizard lists I've been running forgo infantry for lots of monsters, engine, chief, two battleline stegs, and a bastiladon do serious work with way less support heroes. Really only need a starseer, slann, and skink priest for the command ability. I played a lot of lists with kroak to make him work but I feel like he's not a must take for us like some armies have with their centerpiece models. It sucks but he's just too random with casting and his death mechanic and he's honestly so much fun to use. I've ran him with a slann who takes celestial equilibrium, combine with the astrolith and the sages staff I got a +5 to cast on my rolls, only a snake eyes will fail a cast. This reliably gets ten or higher on comet's call too. Only Lumineth with their auto unbinds or Tzeentch with their highest roll is both shenanigans will be able to contest a bonus that high. Definitely try Kroak out but with the monster bonuses this season I feel like thunderlizard is our better faction, and Kroak doesn't do much for them imo.
he's 100% competitive. Just not the "most" competitive. I'd play him in thunder lizard personally, i think draco's tail does better with a regular slann.
sort of tiered- non- for fun semi- can make back its points true competitive to me would be making back points as well as providing a distinct tactical advantage to taking it over leaving it
He can be played for sure, and can really deliver some punches. He won me the day in T1 vs KO. He remains a strong model, but i don't think he can really be competitive in a tournament enviroment, as his effectiveness depends on a case by case scenario.
I recently ran him in an event, went 3-2 in a thunder lizard list, no guard, yes banner. When he is on, he is on... usually means things are going your way. I will say that in 4/5 games he rolled double 1s. 2/4 times on his first cast. so it happens more than I would care to admit. The death function did not come into play with opponents mostly focusing on the monsters etc. Shutting himself down on miscasts was too much of a stumbling block, I would rather bring a slann and other fun units. It just depends on what your trying to do with your army, if you want bomb magic and focus on that, kroak will totally do the trick
Kroak works well in koatl's claw as well. He wants to be up close, and a bunch of knights and carnos will really help him to get in the ranges he wants to be.
Yes. Very much so. Its a very up close and dangerous style of playing him. The trade-off is you get to maximize his potential by being so close. If you are gonna play that combination make sure you get comfortable with the words "Kroak will charge."
High risk high reward? Worth a shot then. Next time I get an AoS game I’ll give something like that a try and let you guys know how it went
I just got the new model painted up and I haven't gotten to try him yet with the new rules. But I'm looking forward to it. Honestly, the random miscast rule seems to be more of a problem than the death mechanics, because it can happen even if you haven't taken any wounds on him and it means he won't get to do anything that turn. If it's your last cast, no big deal. But if it's your first or second, tough luck...
I really wish they would give kroak one thing: If Lord Kroak is included in a seraphon army, he is treated as a general in addition to the model choosen to be the general
I think the problem with Kroak right now is that he is really good against armies we already beat while not helping against armies we struggle against. For example, lumineth and tzeench have enough casting protection that he can't always get our spells off and against SoB this chip damage is just too low. But against armies with little magical protection he is a murder machine, though we already win against those armies with our big dino lists. A normal Slann offers similar board wide magical protection which is great and a little chip damage which is good. He can also do this from the back line which kroak needs to come up front for his spells to be in range.
I think that the reasons you mentioned are a good explanation of why i like kroak. He is good against the same things that our armies are usually good against. so i can tailor my list more to fight our bad matchups and rely on kroak to help keep our good matchups good.
How come nobody talks about the arcane vassal rule? Kroak doesn’t have to be danger close to throw out his spells when you have a skink wizard who’s probably up closer to the enemy behind whatever unit he’s supporting. You can pull off celestial deliverance from 28 inches away from kroak if you have a starpriest or a starseer up the board. Just food for thought.