8th Ed. More basic lizardmen questions...

[buu]

I've been reading all of the tactics articles on this site and they're super useful but they have given me a couple of questions to clarify a few things.

1) The Lizardman faq has the following section:
Page 53 – Kroxigors, Great Reach
Ignore this special rule

So does this mean Kroxigors inside Skink units no longer get their full attacks during close combat and can only make a single supporting attack?

1 a) If the above is correct how do you run Kroxigor units now?


2) How often do you take Loremaster on your Slanns? It seems like every lore has one or two 'super' spells which are the primary reason for taking that lore and just rolling 4 times on the lore chart seems like good odds at missing the spell you really want.

2 a) if you're running two Slanns in something around a 2400 point list, would you take the extra spell die on both of them? And how about loremaster on either? Or is that just overkill considering you have two L4 Wizards?

3) When using Skink skirmishers which can march and still shoot, is there any reason you wouldn't want to move less than 6 inches away so you don't get a long range penalty on your shots? Assuming you're moving already that's a -1 penalty so you might as well move into short range?

4) If you have two Slanns and a unit of Temple Guard do the temple guard's special rules about surrounding Slann only apply to a single Slann?


5) Is there a preferred kit for taking a Stegadon? Bow? Pipes? EOTG? I'm sure this changes depending on what else you have and what else you bring, but are there any quick rules for which one to take?

6) It seems like Light, Life and Death are far and away the preferred lores for the Slanns but is there any situation that would cause you to take one of the other lores? I'm specifically thinking Lore of Metal against Bretts or scary Chaos Armies.


So this list of questions kind of got away from me but I hope some of the answers will be useful to other people.

Thanks =]

 

[forlustria]

I've been reading all of the tactics articles on this site and they're super useful but they have given me a couple of questions to clarify a few things.

1) The Lizardman faq has the following section:
Page 53 – Kroxigors, Great Reach
Ignore this special rule

So does this mean Kroxigors inside Skink units no longer get their full attacks during close combat and can only make a single supporting attack?

1 a) If the above is correct how do you run Kroxigor units now?
I believe they get all thier attacks .the faq takes away the part where they can be targeted

2) How often do you take Loremaster on your Slanns? It seems like every lore has one or two 'super' spells which are the primary reason for taking that lore and just rolling 4 times on the lore chart seems like good odds at missing the spell you really want.
until recently i a;ways took lore master but now if im not taking cupped hands i take plaque of tepok. in a recent tourny every game i got the spells i wanted
2 a) if you're running two Slanns in something around a 2400 point list, would you take the extra spell die on both of them? And how about loremaster on either? Or is that just overkill considering you have two L4 Wizards?
have never run 2 slanns so not sure
3) When using Skink skirmishers which can march and still shoot, is there any reason you wouldn't want to move less than 6 inches away so you don't get a long range penalty on your shots? Assuming you're moving already that's a -1 penalty so you might as well move into short range?
always be aware that unless they have javlins then they may not be able to stand and shoot(depending on oponents movement)
4) If you have two Slanns and a unit of Temple Guard do the temple guard's special rules about surrounding Slann only apply to a single Slann?
yes only one slann per temple guard unit

5) Is there a preferred kit for taking a Stegadon? Bow? Pipes? EOTG? I'm sure this changes depending on what else you have and what else you bring, but are there any quick rules for which one to take?
havnt tried a normal steg. but engine and blow pipes have worked wonders unless facing cannons
6) It seems like Light, Life and Death are far and away the preferred lores for the Slanns but is there any situation that would cause you to take one of the other lores? I'm specifically thinking Lore of Metal against Bretts or scary Chaos Armies.

The recent tourny i went too had alot of empire so would have loved metal
So this list of questions kind of got away from me but I hope some of the answers will be useful to other people.

Thanks =]

answers in blue

 

[Eladimir]

I've been reading all of the tactics articles on this site and they're super useful but they have given me a couple of questions to clarify a few things.

1) The Lizardman faq has the following section:
Page 53 – Kroxigors, Great Reach
Ignore this special rule

So does this mean Kroxigors inside Skink units no longer get their full attacks during close combat and can only make a single supporting attack?

1 a) If the above is correct how do you run Kroxigor units now?


2) How often do you take Loremaster on your Slanns? It seems like every lore has one or two 'super' spells which are the primary reason for taking that lore and just rolling 4 times on the lore chart seems like good odds at missing the spell you really want.
I almost never take loremaster, chances of rolling a double is pretty good. Plus means you spell game is a little different every time which is fun.

2 a) if you're running two Slanns in something around a 2400 point list, would you take the extra spell die on both of them? And how about loremaster on either? Or is that just overkill considering you have two L4 Wizards?
I personally think two lvl 4 slanns is overkill but I've only have done it for one tourney had terrible winds. But from theorizing and arguing with others it could work if you keep them cheap, and one lore good for turns 1 and 2, and another lore thats good when battle is joined. Probably rumination one and ethereal on the one thats running around solo.

3) When using Skink skirmishers which can march and still shoot, is there any reason you wouldn't want to move less than 6 inches away so you don't get a long range penalty on your shots? Assuming you're moving already that's a -1 penalty so you might as well move into short range?

4) If you have two Slanns and a unit of Temple Guard do the temple guard's special rules about surrounding Slann only apply to a single Slann?


5) Is there a preferred kit for taking a Stegadon? Bow? Pipes? EOTG? I'm sure this changes depending on what else you have and what else you bring, but are there any quick rules for which one to take?
Ancient with Blowpipes is by far my favourite. The higher strenght for impact and stomps, 4d6 poison shots are fantastic while your setting up the charge.

6) It seems like Light, Life and Death are far and away the preferred lores for the Slanns but is there any situation that would cause you to take one of the other lores? I'm specifically thinking Lore of Metal against Bretts or scary Chaos Armies.
You should try shadow, works wonders for us, S8 saurus etc.


So this list of questions kind of got away from me but I hope some of the answers will be useful to other people.

Thanks =]

 

[buu]

Thanks for the answers so far, I appreciate it. Another question has just occurred to me though after re-reading the 8th edition charge rules. Am I right in my understanding that the only advantage you get for charging is +1 CR? I suppose there's a couple of special weapons/magics that do something on the charge but other than that?

 

[forlustria]

yeah +1cr for charge unless you charge downhill (start on hill) in which case you get another +1

 

[Qupakoco]

For the Kroxigor supporting attack question, They get all 3 attacks from the 2nd row because they are Monstrous Infantry.

 

[Scalenex]

3) Unless you are fighting a low toughness enemy, the overwhelming majority of your damage will come from poison. You want to make sure you can hit on 6s. Hitting on 5s too is nice but unnecessary. Blowpipes can take multiple shots and hit on 6s while moving only at short range. I like Javelins better because there is no penalty for moving so you can hit on 6s even at long range. They are also quick to fire so you can always stand and shoot with them. Blowpipes can only stand and shoot at things more than a target’s base movement away (usually 4 inches for most things meaning blowpipe Skinks want to stay between 4 and 6 inches of enemies when they can’t avoid the front arc.

5) I prefer giant bows because they are cheaper to field than the others. I face a lot of artillery so if go with Stegadons, I personally prefer quantity over quality but your local metagame is probably different than mine.

6) There is no wrong lore. Life, Light, Death, and Shadow are probably the four most popular in that order. The Tactica index has Tacticas for all eight (though the Metal one is a loose). Metal is viewed as a great niche lore against armies like the Brettonians and Empire but is probably the least used lore by us in general.

Thanks for the answers so far, I appreciate it. Another question has just occurred to me though after re-reading the 8th edition charge rules. Am I right in my understanding that the only advantage you get for charging is +1 CR? I suppose there's a couple of special weapons/magics that do something on the charge but other than that?

The real advantage of charging is qualitative not quanttitative. If you charge you get to decide who fights whom instead of letting your opponent decide that for you (though setting this up advantageously relies on smart deployment and a knowledge of what counters what).

 

[GCPD]

With regards to Skink/Kroxigor units, the Great Reach rule has been FAQ'd because it was superseded by changes to the base rules.

In 8th edition, all models in the second rank participate in combat (Supporting Attacks). Monstrous Infantry may make up to 3 Supporting Attacks.

So as Kroxigor always go in the second rank, and may attack in the second rank as per the main rules, and as they are Monstrous Infantry they may attack up to 3 times (the attacks in their profile), there's no need for the Great Reach rule anymore.

Also forlustria is correct - you may not attack Kroxigor in combat, only Skinks. This makes Skink/Kroxigor units ideal for chasing down high strength/high toughness opponents - the Skinks soak up the damage whilst the Kroxigor whack away. Great for countering Knights!

 

[buu]

Thanks for the replies so far, been a big help. Skink/Kroxigor sound like pretty useful units, although I have to wonder why on earth Kroxigors are strength 4!

For my next question, do you guys use movement trays for Skirmishing Skinks? I'm used to treating them sort of like wh40k models where I just have sort of a blob of skirmishers on the table, but do the new rules mean you have to deploy them in an exact rectangle with ranks and so on?

 

[david l]

The 8th edition rules do mean skirmishers go in a block, like every thing else, just with some vaguely defined spacing. Movement trays work well, and are very handy for clearly defining the front line when redirecting.

 

[Rhodium]

Thanks for the replies so far, been a big help. Skink/Kroxigor sound like pretty useful units, although I have to wonder why on earth Kroxigors are strength 4!

For my next question, do you guys use movement trays for Skirmishing Skinks? I'm used to treating them sort of like wh40k models where I just have sort of a blob of skirmishers on the table, but do the new rules mean you have to deploy them in an exact rectangle with ranks and so on?

There are companies online that make trays especially for skirmishers, with the spacing in between, I swear by them, though you can easily make your own

 

[Anubris]

Thanks for the replies so far, been a big help. Skink/Kroxigor sound like pretty useful units, although I have to wonder why on earth Kroxigors are strength 4!

In the previous army book kroxigor had WS 3, S5 which sounds more logical if you look at their size. However in that edition they could not be fielded in a unit of skinks which made it harder to use them properly. In those days kroxigor usually got killed by melee attacks (they got I 1 and a greatweapon...) or shot by artillery/magic before they could deal massive damage.

Nowadays you can put them in a skink unit, they can dish out all attacks while using skinks as disposable meatshield. In return, I figure GW thought unhittable S7 monsters (S5 + great weapon) were maybe overpowered? I also think kroxigor should be S5 but the way things are now you can effectively bash through S6 attacks (S4 + great weapon) while keeping them alive.