• The forum software have been upgraded to the latest version.

    If you notice anything that looks off, or does not work, please let us know.

    For more information, click here.

Discussion Should we call saurus, skinks and krox she?

BEEGfrog
Razordon

BEEGfrog

Member
Messages
354
Likes Received
1
Trophy Points
18
I was thinking that the most likely explanation for saurus reproduction is that most of the lizardmen breeds are parthenogenic females that deposit eggs in the spawning pools where they lay dormant until conditions arise that bring forth a spawning.

Different conditions in the spawning pools could cause different genes to express themselves to produce the variations between generations and spawnings. There might be only a very small number of different clone lines if there was sufficient capability to vary spawning conditions to program the required expressed gene traits.

If this is correct then almost all lizardmen troops are female clone warriors and should be called she!
 
Hmm I think this thread is more suited to fluff, so I'll move it there.

I'm not sure if it ever mentions eggs in any of the books. I've never really considered LM to come from eggs, I see it as more of a magical thing. But if anything, I invision the spawning pools would be closer to filled with tadpoles (yes I know they come from eggs as well) which grow into whatever is most required at the time.

Can LM really be classified as male or female at all though?
 
They are all genetically engineered clones from the spawning pools.

Ps. Lizardmen don't actually have genders.
 
Thanks. You just made me spend 15 minutes reading the wikipedia article "Gender-neutral pronouns". Good times.
 
I agree that they probably hatch from eggs in the spawning pools, but I don't see why they'd end up male or female as a result. I imagine there to be a rather select group who can actually lay those eggs and the Slann would have to control that, at least indirectly. I think that the bulk would be more akin to drones, sterile and therefore androgynous.

On a related note, I have been lobbying for some time that the proper plural of Saurus are "Sauri", the proper plural of Kroxigor are "Kroxigi" (or "Kroxigal", if BEEGfrog is correct, lol!), whereas more than one Skink are correctly called Skinks.
 
I say the plural of kroxigor is just kroxigor. I would almost say the same for saurus, it sounds right. "Look at all the saurus".

On the other hand, saurii does sound cool. :p
 
strewart said:
I invision the spawning pools would be closer to filled with tadpoles (yes I know they come from eggs as well)
Click to expand...

Tadpoles would mean that all Lizardmen were amphibian though wouldn't it? I think that just applies to the Slaan which is kind of in a boat by it's self as far as creation goes. Also as we learned from Jurassic Park they may be born females but they can change sex. :)

(again though they changed sex due to amphibian DNA in that movie)
 
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=234429 :smug:
The Lizardmen spawning process is a mystery, even to us Lizardmen veterans. I'd love to have more information on this, like a scientific essay or something, as literally nothing is known. I suspect even the Slann do not understand the exact workings of the spawning pools which appear to spew out new life following a schedule set by the Old Ones millennia ago, and I wonder if new spawning pools can be created. I suspect there is some kind of biomatrix on the ground of each spawning pool that cyclically ejects embryos created via parthenogenesis, which would explain why all Lizardmen from one spawning are the same (they would be clones), but that's pure conjecture.

As for the size of a spawning, no one knows, and it probably differs greatly according to the plan of the Old Ones, but if you look at the size of the spawning pools it becomes clear that the number of Lizardmen being spawned within must be limited due to space restrictions and certainly can't reach the size of an army. I'd say one unit per spawning is reasonable to assume (and in accordance with the books). Probably around 20 Saurus Warriors or 30 Skinks or 10 Kroxigors. The only hint we have is that the Skink pools spew forth a new spawning every full moon (so every month) and it would have to be just enough to keep the population stable. The map of Tlaxtlan shows 3 Skink pools in the immediate vicinity of the city, but more undoubtedly exist. Since the Skink poulation can be expected to range in the ten thousands, one could do a little math, but I do not dare. There is no reason to expect great losses during times of peace, and factoring in the hardiness and extreme longevity of the Lizardmen, spawnings really can't be that big. These are no Skaven here.

What we do know though is that at certain times only a single individual emerges from the spawning pool and he will be destined for great things! Skink Priests for example seem to be only children.
Click to expand...
 
On this topic I would like to mention something. What happens when half of a spawned unit dies due to a fight? For example Saurus units work so well together because they are all spawned at the same time. So then when half of a spawning is lost due to a battle what do they do with the rest?

This is how I'm explaining my army of completely different colors on nearly every unit. They are the left overs from lost battles. (I'm still learning to paint so that's why the different color schemes)

However it does raise a good question. Say half a TG unit is lost defending a Slaan. What is done with the rest?
 
From what I understand from the book, units just get smaller all the time, and for example scar veterans are awesome fighters that outlived the rest of their unit. It's still not entirely logical though, it would make sense to combine units into one to keep them of a usable size.

The spawning is an interesting mystery as well. It would be easy to say it's 'just magic', something only the Old Ones could understand and that somehow makes lizardmen jump out of the spawning pools at programmed times. Magic can do anything, after all... But even then it would still be interested to know what goes on inside those pools :P

I've been tempted to use 'Sauri' as the plural of 'Saurus' all the time. Wouldn't know about Kroxigor though, somehow 'Kroxigors' just sounds the most logic. Probably something for another topic, but is there some kind of connection between Kroxigors and all those Beastmen ending in -gor?
 
Good Question....

Not sure, probaly fill in with another spawing from the same pool most of the times.

I think a Lizardmen army themed after a bunch of straglers and survivors, might be prety awesome.
 
Quote form the "High Saurian" thread....

Gender Cases: There are no "genders" in Saurian as warm-bloods recognize them. As Lizards have no genders themselves, the entire concept of gender-based words is an oddity sprung up amongst warm-bloods. In fact, the very name "Lizardmen" is misleading; though many warm-blood societies associate their males with power and strength, Lizards harbor no such biases, not least because Lizards have no males nor females among them. The closest that Lizards get to gender-based communication is that some of the oldest Slann might remember occasional references to certain Old Ones by such names as the World-Mother, or Father of All Turtles. Very few of these are known in everyday Lizard society; when they are used at all, it is by the Slann in their telepathic communications with one another.
Click to expand...
 
Anna said:
I've been tempted to use 'Sauri' as the plural of 'Saurus' all the time. Wouldn't know about Kroxigor though, somehow 'Kroxigors' just sounds the most logic. Probably something for another topic, but is there some kind of connection between Kroxigors and all those Beastmen ending in -gor?
Click to expand...

The plural of Kroxigor IS probably Kroxigors, when you consider that the name itself is an amalgamation of the words Crocodile and Ogre. I thought this was rather obvious when the Lizardmen were re-introduced in the late 90's, just before 5th edition came out. "Croc-Ogre" - say it really fast... The plural of Ogre is Ogres. I think the most acceptable shorthand slag for them is simply "Krox"

Saurus is an actual latin word and common suffix in scientific nomenclature (i.e., Tyrannosaurus, Brontosaurus, etc.). The plural of words ending in "-us" is "-i", hence we speak of more than one Platypus as being Platypi. See also: "rhinoceri" and "octopi". Nevertheless, that said, more than one "tyrannosaurus" are "tyrannosaurs" - see this helpful note: http://dml.cmnh.org/1999Jul/msg00347.html

...but can you imagine Karl Mordskullblood shouting to his companions "hold steady lads, and by Sigmar's axe we shall slay those dirty Saurs!" Hmmm....

According to the usage in GW's books, they are "Saurus Warriors", but that's a mouthful! So IMO, the shorthand wins, which is "Sauri"
 
The Burning Shore, a Black Library novel, describes the adventures of Floring & Lorenzo, 2 Bretonnians who have an adventure in Lustria before returning to their homeland. A short story that follow the novel describes a collection of skink eggs that are brought back to the Bretonnian port town, hatch, and cause all sorts of trouble.

I don't know if this can be taken as canon (and it struck me as wrong when I read the story), but it is some evidence that Lizardmen come ultimately from eggs.

Actually, its been a few years since I read that story. It is possible that the skinks were already hatched/spawned when they were brought aboard the ship, but I'm pretty sure that eggs were mentioned. I'll check tonight if I can find the book.
 
Sadly the black library authors don't read up on GW fluff before wrighting thir books,
and are generaly considered non-cannnon.

Check out the short story of Marco Columbo from the 5th edition Lizardmen book.
 
n810 said:
Sadly the black library authors don't read up on GW fluff before wrighting thir books,
and are generaly considered non-cannnon.
Click to expand...

That's what I figured. It a shame, because the second novel in that series is set in the Ogre Kingdoms and gives a lot of really interesting background into that race. Its too bad that all that back story may not be "true".
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top