8th Edition: Are tactics dead?

[Gor-rok]

Do you think the added randomness and simplification of rules has hurt Warhammer as a strategy game? If so, how?

The consensus around my game store is that the movement phase is what made WFB so tactical and challenging, and that the changes to it lessened the overall skill level needed to compete.

I somewhat disagree. It's still chess on steroids, but now your pieces behave even more unpredictably. You can just cross your fingers and roll the dice now, but the more I play of 8th the more I find the need to plan ahead even further in the game. There's fewer guarantees- all the wizards in the world won't do you any good when you roll snake eyes on a magic phase, for example- and it's no longer enough for me to have a single backup plan. I need three or four, and I have to make them up as I go.

I'd love to hear people's opinion on this. As a newer player, I probably lack the perspective of some of you veterans.

 

[strewart]

To be honest, I probably haven't played enough 8th ed games to really judge it properly yet. However, I do think the early arguments of simplifying the movement phase has not ruined any of the tactics of the game, it has just made the movement phase run a lot smoother and easier, you still have to get units into the right place at the right time. With charge ranges becoming unpredictable (I'm still not sure if I like that) you really need to be closer than before to ensure a successful charge when you really need it, and deployment will still play a very very important part as it always has.

In fact, in some ways I think it is actually less point and click than it was before. In 7th ed, I could barrel my unit of 8 Dragon Princes headlong into a block, cause a huge amount of casualties, leave nothing to strike back, force them to test on insane courage and break them. Bret players the same with their lance formation. Now, with steadfast and stepping up, I do the same charge and they hold due to having at least one rank still, strike back with two ranks rather than nothing, and next turn I am stuck facing them at s3 and not hanging around. Getting flank charges can be very important now if you don't want a long war of attrition between two blocks.

 

[kroxigor01]

My first impression is that it is just a completely different game (definitely not inferior, edging towards superior).

Also, I LOVE rolling snake eyes on winds of magic

It means I get to cast 2 spells on 2 dice with 1 useless dispel dice opposing me. Sure if I rolled double 6 more spells can potentially be cast, but with snake eyes you get the 2 BEST spells with no response possible.

I think the best roll is double 2. This way you get to fast 4 spells and only 1 can be dispelled.

 

[Haemoglobin]

Unless you're facing armies with extra Dispel Dice options (damned Dwarfs )

 

[Vilicate]

The only issue that I have is that I was really really confident about 7th ed. I knew the rules really well, and always have done well in my w/l/d in tournaments.

I don't feel as confident about 8th ed, but I feel like I can be pretty good at this edition. I was never a player who really planned ahead, i reacted to whatever my opponent did and then countered. I didn't make a lot of mistakes in my gameplay. Now, it's seems to be that if you make mistakes, sometimes (though this was true to a lesser degree in 7th) that you can roll your way out of them. Flanking isn't nearly as powerful as most units can just pass a leadership test and turn to face.

I'm not saying that they ruined the game, it's just different and I don't feel like ANYONE has been playing enough to really make a good judgment on which system is superior. I'm going to give it a year to mature (i'll be playing the entire time) before I get really down on the system and perminently switch to 40k or Hordesmachine.