8th Ed. Blade of Realities vs Banner of the World Dragon

[SilverFaith]

This might sound stupid, but someone made a problem of this.

We JUST finished a game that ended in a draw, solely because we ended up rolling for this, and he won. Short story is, I had an Oldblood with BoR in combat with a Lord of his, in a unit with Banner of the World Dragon. He said that, since his banner specifically gives a ward save against magic weapons, he was still allowed to use his save, despite BoR denying any kind of armour or ward saves. This meant his lord remained at 1 wound, as he saved all 3 wounds I had inflicted on him.

I called bullshit, but he insisted, and in the end, we rolld off, and he won.

I searched around, but found no mention of this, presumeably because no one have tried to WAAC so hard before. Have any of you ever heard of someone ruling it this way?

 

[Ondjage]

That doesn't make any sense what so ever...

He wanted to roll a ward save against the blade of realities? A 100 point item, which only function is to ignore ward saves?

 

[SilverFaith]

That doesn't make any sense what so ever...

He wanted to roll a ward save against the blade of realities? A 100 point item, which only function is to ignore ward saves?

Yep. I was thrown off for a bit as well when he said he wanted his ward save, and calmly just told him that no, a magic weapon whose primary function is to ignore ward saves, does not, in fact, allow him to make ward saves. He made a big deal of it, and refused to acknowledge that his version made no sense.

Some rules seem like grey areas, and I am often good at seeing how a rule can be interpreted in two different ways. But here? No. I see no way that you could possibly get to this conclusion.

 

[Scalenex]

Your opponent was absurd. I don't see how a referee would judge allowing the ward save unless he was bribed. Your opponent basically cheated. He was upset because the Banner of the World Dragon is only 99% effective. The Banner bestows a ward save, the sword ignores ward saves.

There is a lot of gray areas in the rules but this case lacks grayness.

 

[SilverFaith]

Your opponent was absurd. I don't see how a referee would judge allowing the ward save unless he was bribed. Your opponent basically cheated. He was upset because the Banner of the World Dragon is only 99% effective. The Banner bestows a ward save, the sword ignores ward saves.

There is a lot of gray areas in the rules but this case lacks grayness.

It was a... "friendly" game. A new player had found my local group, and we had planned the battle today. I was vary of him, because he kept calling himself a "tournament veteran", and kept calling his list "overpowered". Which is funny, because I have lost to the most ridiculous lists, yet this battle actually seemed fairly easy, compared to the normal HE player our group has.

Glad I'm not the only one who thinks the other interpretion is completely absurd.

 

[Mr Phat]

what is this ?

Yes...the banner gives a 2+ wardsave against the blade of realities.
No...he cannot use it as the blade negates wardsaves!?
A wardsave is a wardsave, it does not become stronger by having specefic things it works against.

"NO WARDSAVES CAN BE TAKEN AGAINST THE BLADE OF REALITIES"
"but I have a wardsave"
"sure, get your 2+! ill even throw in that you get a 1+ for this particular round just to be nice! ..........YOU STILL CANT USE IT!"


he sounds like the kind of guy who takes ASF re-rolls on "Curse of the midnight wind" re-rolls...

 

[rantapanda]

lol....
yeah. there is no possible sane interpretation of the rules to allow him to get his ward saves.
same thing would be putting a noble with armour of destiny, which allows ward save against ANYTHING, not just spells and magic weapons.
"aod gives me wardsaveeee derrrrrrr"
"sorry, blade of realities"
"I STILL GET WARDSAVE COS AOD"
......

you can deem that game as a victory for yourself.

 

[Mr Phat]

you can deem that game as a victory for yourself.

Thats my verdict too.

 

[Pinktaco]

Uhm lol. I'd love to take a peek in that persons mind and see how it works. So here's the thing: the ward would've worked against any other magicsl weapon from the BRB. He's probably used to claiming a ward against those that when he saw your weapon he wouldn't budge. As others have stated it's absurd because you only need to read the rules to understand how it works. Tbh he sounds like he became desperate. Sometimes people may do odd things when they're about to lose. Next time you just give your OB and AoD along with a dawnstone and a great weapon. He'll die just the same with less discussion lol.

 

[SilverFaith]

Uhm lol. I'd love to take a peek in that persons mind and see how it works. So here's the thing: the ward would've worked against any other magicsl weapon from the BRB. He's probably used to claiming a ward against those that when he saw your weapon he wouldn't budge. As others have stated it's absurd because you only need to read the rules to understand how it works. Tbh he sounds like he became desperate. Sometimes people may do odd things when they're about to lose. Next time you just give your OB and AoD along with a dawnstone and a great weapon. He'll die just the same with less discussion lol.

I've had more success with GW + heavy magic items, but Lightsaber wielding lizardmen are just too cool to pass up.

I run a Saurus-heavy list, so I don't really delve that much into "min/maxing" my lists. And hey, BoR isn't a bad item by any means - Ignoring both armour and ward saves is pretty potent, to of course, S5+GW means you practically ignore armour already, but the ward save is a pretty unique thing to ignore.

And most of the things I want my Oldblood to kill have T3 to begin with, so I still wound on 2s most of the time.

 

[Amrod]

I think it works like this:
1. Is a Magic Weapon? Yes.
2. Banner activation of 2+ WS (my mistake).
3. Now, the Magic Weapon is the BoR.
4. Banner of the World Dragon turn off!
5. The End!

 

[SilverFaith]

1. Is a Magic Weapon? Yes.
2. Banner activation of WS 2+.

I believe we already concluded this question. And this answer is also very wrong, as the banner doesn't give the unit WS +2. It grants a +2 Wardsave.

 

[teufelhund]

Next time you just give your OB and AoD along with a dawnstone and a great weapon.

+1 and just for kicks don't forget the other trickster's shard.