8th Ed. Chakax vs making your own character?????

[mcasefire]

So I was just curious. I would love to run Chakax in my tournament. The problem that I am seeing is that Chakax is 335 points, but he is so awesome. I am asking if you would run him in a 2500 point list along with a slann? I am wondering if you could build a better character for cheaper and just as good as Chakax? Let me know.

 

[scruffyryan]

You can run a lord level saurus warrior for cheaper than chakax. You can run 2 kitted out hero level saurus for around the same price as chakax.

Chakax is woefully overpriced for what he brings to the table.

 

[strewart]

Yep, fun character but very overpriced for what he brings. Plus he is really only good in a challenge - you will either face a hero level character who will refuse to avoid being slaughtered, or a lord level which will still challenge Chakax and may win. Outside the challenge he isn't really that hard to bring down for his points.

If you stick him and a Slann in a TG unit you are looking at over 1000 points for that unit, which is absolutely huge. Close to half your army in one unit. It only has M4, it can't be everywhere, opponents will seek to avoid it and break down the rest of your army then maybe target with full force toward the end of the game. Might be fun to run occasionally in friendlies, but don't bother at a tournament.

Plus you may lose comp score for having a special character.

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

I personally wouldn't go for Chakax. I like his story and the model is pretty cool as well, but he is terribly overpriced in my opinion. With the 8th edition rules the Slann + temple guard unit can be made virtually unbreakable (cold blooded stubborn leadership 10 with a reroll) with the standard of discipline which makes one of Chakax's main ability all but pointless.

I'd say if you want to play him for fun.... no problem, but if you're going into a tournament you can get more value for you points by creating your own character.

 

[TheRolfgar]

He is uesfull because the slann can be challenged by another character even though he is in the 2nd rank.

Even saying that, he is overpriced. If you want a true "deathstar" TG unit he does fit the bill.

 

[novatomato]

Try out a Scar-Vet, with Light armour, Sword of the Hornet, Enchanted Shield, and Potion of Speed.
the total cost of this guy comes out to exactly 200 points less than chakax, and he has a 2+ AS, Always Strike First all the time, when needed he can use the potion to get I7 ASF, which will quite regularly give him a rerol to hit, every Stat is the same as chakax and the only benefit chakax has over him would be that in challenges the enemies magic items are mundane, and 5+ ward save in challenges, that is it.
Alternatively give the same scarvet Armour of Fortune, Gold Sigil Sword, and a shield, same 2+ AS with a 5+ WS all the time, plus he is hitting first against almost everything, and this one is only three points more than the first one.

So, for the Price of Chakax, we could get BOTH of the two scar-vets I put forward and they are more survivable in and out of challenges (maybe as survivable in challenges).

 

[TheRolfgar]

You clearly underestimate the value of turning magic weapons into mundane. That can be huge against special characters or any lord level fighty guy. I'm not arguing that he isn't overpriced, he is, and outside of a challenge he's garbage too.

 

[novatomato]

You clearly underestimate the value of turning magic weapons into mundane. That can be huge against special characters or any lord level fighty guy.

Not really, as a large proportion of combat lords will have a strength high enough to get through his armour save without magic weapons, ASF weapons are useless anyways and anyone who needs re-rolls to hit from a weapon probably shouldn't be attacking him anyway. Also, when someone sees chakax in the unit they won't challenge, or will challenge with their champ meaning Chakax has one turn to smash a single poor unfortunate soul into pulp while the combat lord will just carve through the temple guard. After that one round you're already in big trouble so a challenge between the two characters isn't going to do you much good anymore.
that is assuming that people know about chakax, and since on other forums at the time of the new army book their were several topics per forum titled "OMG CHAKAX CHEESE" or other variations, that is highly likeyl they do know about him.

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

He is uesfull because the slann can be challenged by another character even though he is in the 2nd rank.

Does anyone else find this a bit odd? I really think that GW screwed up here. Why on earth would the Slann be placed in the second rank of a temple guard unit and still be a viable target for a challenge. What's more, is that he isn't even allowed to ever leave the unit because the Temple guard would never leave his side, yet they have no problem letting him take a challenge. haha

 

[Huichi Mixi]

He is uesfull because the slann can be challenged by another character even though he is in the 2nd rank.

Does anyone else find this a bit odd? I really think that GW screwed up here. Why on earth would the Slann be placed in the second rank of a temple guard unit and still be a viable target for a challenge. What's more, is that he isn't even allowed to ever leave the unit because the Temple guard would never leave his side, yet they have no problem letting him take a challenge. haha

Yeah but thats no problem, you either refuse the challenge with him and he goes to the back and doesn't fight which is good. You could also accept with the temple guard champ. It is inconsenquential having challenges at the slann since no sane person would accept with him

 

[Arli]

I play a brett player who likes to take the virtue that forces you to accept the challenge. He tries to get to my TG and kill my champ. Then challenge the slann. Because he is forced to take the challenge, he has the chance to kill the slann. I think it has only worked once though. For that reason, sometimes I will equip my slann with weapons as well as other magic items.

As to the rule that allows the slann to be challenged. I think it is the make way rule, but I am not sure. Anyway, it is surely an oversight on the part of GW. Maybe when the new book comes out, they will make it so that any TG can accept a challenge. That would make perfect sense.

 

[Durandal]

He is uesfull because the slann can be challenged by another character even though he is in the 2nd rank.

Does anyone else find this a bit odd? I really think that GW screwed up here. Why on earth would the Slann be placed in the second rank of a temple guard unit and still be a viable target for a challenge. What's more, is that he isn't even allowed to ever leave the unit because the Temple guard would never leave his side, yet they have no problem letting him take a challenge. haha

It might just be a wording oversight (I haven't checked the 7th edition challage rules), as the current challenge rules are worded specifically to only keep you from being able to back-rank the enemy's General who, while in the same combat, isn't in a unit in base contact with the challenging unit (technicallly a challenged character need not be in base contact with an enemy, just his unit, and he doesn't need to be able to legally move into base contact with his challenger). And unlike Deathrollas, I doubt that GW gets enough emails for it to be addressed in a couple of years, so we'll need to wait for a new book to fix it, until 9th which redoes the way challanges work and they miss this little tid-bit again.

I think it is the make way rule, but I am not sure.

It's not "Make Way", that merely allows you to reposition a character for optimum damage in a combat (say, to cover a flank, or get into B2B to hit that big monster). Challengers just need the challenger's unit to be in B2B with an enemy unit with a challengeable model, and any non-unit champion characters in said B2B unit can legally accept, even if you can't legally move them B2B.

 

[gapton]

Maybe the all mighty GENERAL of the army, being the best mage in the world, refusing and shy-away from a challenge initiated by a mere mortal (or daemon) would be so moral-defeating to the fellow skinks and sauruses that the Slann only has one true answer to a challenge.

Except that the Slann didn't know that GW forbid him to use his magical power during close combat! LOL

 

[magician]

The Sl[pic][/pic]ann MUST be placed in the second rank. Unless you can get him in BtB he CANNOT accept a challenge, since he can't move into the front rank.

Unless he's in BtB with the enemy he can't be penalized for not accepting a challenge. You can only penalize a valid recipient of a challenge.

 

[Arli]

8th edition rules allow the challenge of characters not in the front rank. It does not matter where the character is in the unit. However, it only becomes a problem when you are forced to accept the challenge. In most cases, I would rather have my slann decline the challenge and get the additional attacks from my TG anyway.

 

[Huichi Mixi]

Accept with unit champ or scar vet. If its one of these ultra killy bret lords who you must accept with, keep accepting with unit champ then keep ressurecting him using your lore of life slann. Perfect way to waste his awesome hundreds of points of killing power on 1 wound model every turn providing you can get regrowth off. He will think twice with that build again in the future, since you can exploit it.

 

[troubled_joe]

Accept with unit champ or scar vet. If its one of these ultra killy bret lords who you must accept with, keep accepting with unit champ then keep ressurecting him using your lore of life slann. Perfect way to waste his awesome hundreds of points of killing power on 1 wound model every turn providing you can get regrowth off. He will think twice with that build again in the future, since you can exploit it.

How do you figure? You can only resurrect models in your own magic phase. He can challenge in both yours and his own combat phase. So it would be:

Bret turn
- Bret charges, challenges
- Unit champ accepts, and is killed

Lizards turn
- Unit champ is resurrected
- Bret challenges, champ accepts, is killed

Bret turn
- Bret challenges
- Champ is still dead, so Slann has to accept

If you've also got a scar vet in there, you can milk this a bit longer, but that's a bit of a pointsink