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9th Age Discussion of OpenHammer (ETC) and Ninth Age (Swedish Comp)

The Sauric Ace said:
To be fair it does seems like the HE thread on the Warhammer forum has sort of done a sinus curve, and come back to the original conclusion you recommended, that is that a price increase and perhaps a slight change to the stubborn rule, would be a good solution.
I reckon this might be because there eventually came more severe suggestion, for nerfing the White Lions. It was interesting to follow people thoughts on the subject and I really believe that most of the people does see the issues with their armies.
Apparently they just need to be confronted with actual proper solutions, along side far-fetched completely "GamesWarkshop"-wierd-styled changes.

PS: I reckon it was better to continue the debate in the actual thread about it, since we were actual suppose to be discussing saurus warriors usefulness, in the other thread :p
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Yeah well I have to be honest. The White Lion unit almost pisses me off. Not because "derp high elves", but because they're insanely good and have some very very good special rules (cloak/stubborn) and on top of that have the option to take an incredible magic banner that can render an entire army useless against that one particular unit.

The value in White Lions is just through the roof. In my opinion they could be 15pts/model with Swordmasters at 12/13pts because S5 is just so much worse than S6 ._____.

Anyway good call to continue the discussion here.
 
Agrem said:
In a way I think the developers have driven themselves in a bit of a corner. For example with the discussed HE and WoC.

Problem is that with such huge community project where you like to hear what other people think about stuff and make the decisions based upon them it is almost impossible to find one consensus. Therefore the developers would need to make decisions just based on their own ideas, feelings and calculations. But after that some people still disagree and won't accept the results. Hard job got to admit as you cannot please everyone.

Nevertheless I think they've done an awesome job so far with this and I'm still looking forward what they will bring out. Personally I would like to keep playing the 8th ed with just minor tweaks here and there but the 9th age seems to be the next best thing for me and I'll gladly take up on it if the people that I play with will also.

BR
Agrem
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Yeah it's the classic issue when you do something community driven. They MUST do decisions of their own because otherwise the rest of us will drag them down. I think most people are okay with the BRB changes, but we'll have to see if things go nuclear once they actually start with the armies, however, they have already said that they're looking at ~10 changes/army so rage might be minimal. We'll see.
 
Pinktaco said:
The value in White Lions is just through the roof. In my opinion they could be 15pts/model with Swordmasters at 12/13pts because S5 is just so much worse than S6 ._____.
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I honestly thought that they were about that price range when I first saw how good they are, at least! I reckon a 15 pts/model isn't half bad, give elves an increase in the value of swordsmasters and core and I guess no HE players can't complain (They will undoubtedly, just look at the ridiculous arguments on the warhammer forum), such changes seems fair and actually really interesting. Granting new mechanics to the meta game and making lesser used units valuable. As it is now, WL are used because they are too good and thus other units seems poor in comparison; obviously I'm all for taking a look at DE WoC and DoC as well, since they have some of the same problems. It bugs me that sometimes it feels like those are arguments for why a overpowered unit shouldn't be changed.
"But those guys are also overpowered, so thus we need our overpowered unit to compensate!"

Hopefully the Comp. guys will understand this principle and give a little and take a little. No one will play, if their army only got "Nerfed" (Increase points for good units).
 
Well one of the moderators already agreed with me or at least put out the same arguement that WLs could easily take a point increase so I hope something happens.
 
Pinktaco said:
but we'll have to see if things go nuclear once they actually start with the armies
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That's when things could get real messy and when a lot of people may abandon 9th age. Fingers crossed that it will work out well.
 
Pinktaco said:
Well one of the moderators already agreed with me or at least put out the same arguement that WLs could easily take a point increase so I hope something happens.
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That's at least a good sign ;)
I don't necessarily think the moderators are disillusioned, about the various of overpowered units out there. The problem occurs when the people playing the armies don't see this issue, as @NIGHTBRINGER so nicely pointed out.
 
How would people feel like a removal of the predatory fighter special rule?
 
... depends, what does it get replaced with ?
 
Pinktaco said:
How would people feel like a removal of the predatory fighter special rule?
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It wouldn't bother me all that much. It typically has a pretty low impact, both positively and negatively. I would miss it on Kroxigors I suppose; "free" S7 attacks is always nice. Overall though, it isn't that big of a deal. At least the debate over how the predatory fighter rule should be interpreted would become obsolete.
 
I think predatory fighter makes for a cool fluffy rule. You occasionally get to hit once more. Awesome. It's not powerful, but it is pretty cool.

I'd be sad if it goes. It really just needs one line (This rule applies to attacks made from supporting ranks) and now it is all fixed. Easy-peasy.
 
LawGnome said:
It really just needs one line (This rule applies to attacks made from supporting ranks) and now it is all fixed. Easy-peasy.
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I agree that it is a pretty easy fix. I'd also add that a nearby Slann can allow the predatory fighter unit to test to restrain pursuit (just like a Skink character does).
 
I'm an advocate for those two simple add on as well ;)

In generally I think it's a great fluff - wise rule, that needs very little to make it work as a proper advantageous special rule. Removing it should really come with something better on pair with the rule.

As I've mentioned on the warhammer forum, it really isn't that complicated either. Since sixes are not that difficult to spot, by now our eyes are pretty much already trained to it, due to the many poisonous shots we have grown so acustom to ;)
 
I don't really care in either way. As mentioned PF is not that huge impact on the game and I don't really agree on the arguments that it is time consuming either. It takes you like 20 seconds to pick up more dice and throw them in a 2,5-3,5h game so no big deal.

Also as mentioned the rule can be big on characters where usually the 1-2 more attacks matter more also from the sheer percentage amount point of view.

Got to say though that more I read the topics over TWF the less I like the wishlisting that is going on in there. Seems that every second poster has their own way of looking at things and the views are quite biased due to the meta they play in with their friends or local gaming groups. Also as mentioned no one is really ready to give up anything but everyone should get a boost of somekind.

BR
Agrem
 
Agrem said:
Also as mentioned no one is really ready to give up anything but everyone should get a boost of somekind.
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This sums up the general debate at the WHF, pretty well :)
It really just is a bunch of ideas now, though; so perhaps we'll first see some more cohesive arguments, once we get a first draft of all the army books. At least the people making the changes, seems fairly competent.
 
I would be sad to see PF go, I want it actually clarified for supporting ranks not got rid of! Also agree about the Slann counting for the purposes of restraint (that was an odd one).
 
Gor-Rok is a crazy PF powered killing machine.
 
n810 said:
Gor-Rok is a crazy PF powered killing machine.
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That's true, Gor-Rok definitely benefits a lot more from the PF rule. Re-rolls to hit and PF attacks on 5's & 6's is pretty potent.
 
.... curious, What is the maximum number of attacks with gor-rok ?
 
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