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AoS How is 3rd Edition going so far?

Discussion in 'Seraphon Discussion' started by Kilvakar, Oct 31, 2021.

  1. Putzfrau
    Skar-Veteran

    Putzfrau Well-Known Member

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    This is what he ran at everwinter. I was told it's the same list but not 100% positive.

    received_700101874740959.jpeg
     
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  2. Putzfrau
    Skar-Veteran

    Putzfrau Well-Known Member

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    Darren takes first at the hampshire gt with three ark of soteks lol.


    Allegiance: Seraphon
    - Constellation: Thunder Lizard
    - Grand Strategy: Beast Master
    - Triumphs:

    Engine of the Gods (265)**
    - General- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
    - Artefact: Incandescent Rectrices
    - Mount Trait: Beastmaster
    - Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
    Lord Kroak (430)***
    Saurus Astrolith Bearer (150)***
    - Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
    Celestant-Prime, Hammer of Sigmar (325)***- Allies

    5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
    10 x Skinks (75)**
    - Boltspitters & Moonstone Clubs
    10 x Skinks (75)**
    - Boltspitters & Moonstone Clubs

    Bastiladon with Ark of Sotek (165)*
    Bastiladon with Ark of Sotek (165)*
    Bastiladon with Ark of Sotek (165)*
    Umbral Spellportal (70)*

    Alpha-Beast Pack**
    Battle Regiment***
    Warlord
    Artefact
    Total: 2000 / 2000Reinforced Units: 0 / 4Allies: 325 / 400Wounds: 104Drops: 7
     
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  3. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    Well, Lord Kroak and Celestant Prime.
    I presume that at that point the ark of sotek were acting as immovable obj grabbers, they certainly weren’t doing the heavy lifting.

    Interesting list, anyway.
    I was pondering something similar bur without the ally.
     
  4. Tombomb7
    Cold One

    Tombomb7 Well-Known Member

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    Needs more Arks
    Seriously though I have to run one now, they seem too useful.
     
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  5. Tyranitar
    Ripperdactil

    Tyranitar Well-Known Member

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    Our 3rd edition book is going to be so bad lol
     
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  6. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    eh, what? o_O

    did i miss something?
     
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  7. Bowser
    Slann

    Bowser Third Spawning

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    Maybe it will be amazing and fix some of the problems with lack of rend and mortal wounds.
     
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  8. Erta Wanderer
    OldBlood

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    i think the idea is that we have people who can make even the very very bad stuff in our books work and so GW will over corect.
     
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  9. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    Ah, yes... we are too capable for our own good. :D
     
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  10. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    Out of curiousity, did the bastiladons actually do anything interesting/important beyond just sitting on an objective?
    Cuz the rest of that list is fairly standard. So blaming the victory on the bastiladon and demanding a nerf seems a bit silly.
     
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  11. Erta Wanderer
    OldBlood

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    they did not.
    GW is often silly
     
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  12. Tyranitar
    Ripperdactil

    Tyranitar Well-Known Member

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    @Erta Wanderer got it, our book is just winning events non-stop with so many different lists, subfactions and units that GW is going to completely nerf us into the ground. We're going to get Slaanesh'ed...brace for impact
     
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  13. Erta Wanderer
    OldBlood

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    i don't really agree with this sentiment. slaanesh is bad for a few reasons hitting each other at once the book when it came out was fine. not good just fine.
     
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  14. Tombomb7
    Cold One

    Tombomb7 Well-Known Member

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    I don't know. I mean all our Saurusnstuff is bad which is basically half the book, then the flying units aren't great either, nor is the Oracle on Troglodon. While other armies like Slaves got cool rules for warcry bands we didn't. Our rend is bad. Also vs some new AOS units like Dragons block half the Slann or Kroak mortal wounds which is significant. Then there is the Ark which isn't exactly iconic in terms of output but can be made work as a roadblock vs high rend. Let's not mention razor's
    We have a nice selection of units in our book which h allows us to make things work. Even at that we don't really see much of Fangs of Sotek or Koatls Claw, Dracothians tail is Salamander spam so that's just one unit in the whole book.
    Of our book changes then at worst I imagine they'll want to see more of our bad units, so they will be reworked to be good, so we can keep creating lists that keep us relevant
    This is my view and my hope
     
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  15. Putzfrau
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    Putzfrau Well-Known Member

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    They are super cheap, super tanky, and do mortal wounds. I mean the game is won by "sitting on objectives" so I'd say that's pretty important.
     
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  16. Kilvakar
    Carnasaur

    Kilvakar Well-Known Member

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    And don't forget good Allegiance abilities ;) But yeah, a significant portion of the army is not good. However, that seems to be true for most armies that have a large model range. A few of said models seem to be very powerful while the rest are average to bad. 3e rulebooks seem to be trying to change this (Stormcast is a good example), but even in 3e books you have balance issues. Orruks have Ironjawz as the best part of the army and Bonesplitterz as the worst, for example. I wish that GW would at least try to give all the models in any given army at least some good reason to be used...

    This is definitely how GW tends to do things. We already saw Rippers and Razordons go from some of our best units to garbage with our last book, I imagine Salamanders will end up in the bin with our 3e book. However, I still also have hope that they will buff the stuff that's currently bad (Saurus, flyers) to make them useable while leaving stuff that's good but not OP (Stegadons, Skinks) more or less as it is. Since it's almost a given that most of our buff stacking will go away I think it's almost a given that we'll see stat increases, extra rend, extra attacks, better profiles, etc., on most units. Most things will probably go up in points again, but we should see a lot more built-in buffs and abilities and less reliance on command-ability stacking which we can no longer do.

    I just hope that we keep our magical strength. Kroak's already been nerfed enough, and I hope that in our new battletome he either gains a ward save or loses his crappy random death rule. The Slann is fine how he is. If our spell lore could actually debuff the enemy or damage them, then you might be able to call our spellcasting OP. But as it is now, we just throw out a bunch of random (though not insignificant) buffs on as many units as possible.

    Also, even though we're still winning a lot, I think by the time our books comes around Seraphon will have fallen off the top of the charts enough to avoid the "revenge nerf," hopefully...

    Yeah, can't argue with that. Either sit on objectives or delete the opposing army so that they can't sit on objectives. Even with the mortal wounds chance, Ark of Sotek is still only doing *maybe* a couple points of damage per combat phase if you're lucky. But if your opponent doesn't have a lot of mortal wounds or rend -2 or -3 attacks, they're going to have a hard time shifting Bastiladons of any type.

    I think as our "good" stuff keeps going up in points, you're going to see people continuing to try out and have good luck with the "bad" stuff that people aren't used to playing against. We may not be the most popular army, but we have a lot of really dedicated and skilled players and a large enough model range that we can experiment with lists and not just run the "spam these two units" lists that armies like DoK and Ironjawz do.
     
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  17. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    Sigh....
    well that is definitly true.

    All that's needed for a unit to sit on an objective is that it exists. That's a pretty low treshhold for "important", literally anything can do that.
    If that's all they did every game, then this list isn't really different from our usual lists. It's still just a list where the usual 3-4 units do all the heavy lifting while the rest of the list just sits on an objective waiting for the game to end.
     
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  18. Putzfrau
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    Putzfrau Well-Known Member

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    That's not true. Some things sit on objectives a lot bigger than others.

    And it is different. It has 3 ark of soteks. You don't spend 500 points on arks and have "the same list" as any other. Thats not fair to darren.

    The way you describe the game sometimes is just not very realistic or so reductive it eliminates any kind of potential conversation.

    Sometimes I wonder what experience youve had that leads you to such extreme conclusions.

    Its a list with arks man. Enjoy it for what it is.

    Lizardmen/seraphon have literally never been bad. You don't have anything to worry about.
     
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  19. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    Unless you have a battlereport that shows that he did something with his bastiladons that was more interesting than just park them on an objective while Kroak & friends went around murdering the opponent there isn't a whole lot to enjoy about this list as it's fundamentally the same kinda list we always see.

    The list can essentially be summerized as:
    Standard Kroak-combo
    EoTG
    Celestant prime

    A bunch of efficient bodies to dump on an objective, but aren't expected to actually do much of anything else. And we have a handfull of different choices for these efficient bodies.

    I mean, great that this time some arks are used instead of the more common armies of skinks or knights. But unless @Erta Wanderer was wrong when he said the bastiladons didn't do anything of note it's really not all that different from the usual lists.
     
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  20. Putzfrau
    Skar-Veteran

    Putzfrau Well-Known Member

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    Arks aren't skinks so provide something different from skinks. You are mistaken in how narrowly you're looking at ths.
     
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