AoS I just had my first real match as Seraphon, against Chaos. I destroyed him, and then we had a talk

Wait, so what did you mean with your trick then?

"Another minor tactic, is to use melee units' 1" attacks first. If you use your 2" attacks first and kill a significant amount (say like 30% of enemy squad) then if they're smart, they'll just pull all the units within 1" and leave you with nothing to hit. They get to pile in regardless so no loss for them. (This can backfire if you actually do well with jaws (UNLIKELY) and kill too much making your spears worse, if your opponent does the same tactic removing the models in base-to-base.) It would stop your 2nd rank of spear soldiers from hitting."

Won't they just remove the ones at the back? Or could they say remove the front, and they could choose not to pile in or something?

 

I took a look at your list and I love it I'm actually considering using it.

However, I also love the army I mentioned previously, as it allows me to use all Saurus common units at once. Instead of the Skink priest, how about I use the Skink Starpriest, and I take another 5 guards? They won't get the extra attack because the Eternity Warden isn't nearby, but I can put them in the front, buff them with Mythic shield and/or the -1 on attacks against buff from the Starpriest, and let them soak up the enemy charge to keep my Warrior stack fresh. I won't have the rerolls (except the ones the Slann gives against ranged attackers), but I'll be able to use my guards for what they are best at: Take hits (base 4+, 3+ when near Seraphon heroes, 2+ thanks to mythic shield, and -1 on all attacks against them).

It will look like this:

Bloodclaw Starhost= 100
Oldblood= 100 (Instead of Oldblood on Carnosaur)
Scar Veteran on Carnosaur= 260
Scar veteran on Cold one= 100
Sunblood= 120
Unit of 40 Saurus warriors= 400
Unit of 15 Saurus knights= 360
Unit of 10 Saurus guards= 200

Starpriest= 100
Slann Starmaster = 260 (for both the 1 reroll on hit/+1 spell/Charge, as well as the save rerolls in the shooting phase. All the other heroes can also use their command abilities due to the Bloodclaw starhost)

The idea is that I either A) Split up my army into the 40 warrior pile with the 10 guards in front of them, and the Starpriest and Slann Starmaster behind them, as well as the Sunblood and Oldblood among them. And then make a second group of my Scar vet on cold one, 15 knights unit, and scar vet on carnosaur. So they can charge from the sides. The advantage of having one unit of 15 knights is that I can attack with them first, like the 40 warrior stack, so I can deal maximum damage.

Or B) I actually place my second group of knights, and scar veterans behind my Slann with the other units in front of him. Because of this, they will receive the Slann's bonus at the start of the hero phase (I believe the buff stays until your next hero phase? Even if they move away from your Slann?), so when the enemy engages your front army, you can then use your Oldblood's command to move your cavalry units way up front (within 10 feet, the Oldblood on foot can select a unit. Your units can then be positioned within 3" around that unit, so you can put them behind your engaged warriors, move over the enemy line, and then charge their backline.

How does this idea sound? You'd get both warriors, knights, and guards for a cool looking army!

Or should I, like you suggested, not use the 10 guards but use 20 buffed warriors with clubs as the frontline to make it more casual?

 

I like this build with the knights! I have always had 2 groups of knights when I use them, so it would be interesting if you used one big group and let us know the damage output from the match. Looks like great fun.

 

You mean my latest army? (With the guards up front) Or his?

 

Your latest army, though I do quite like his as well. While @Bradifer list looks like a blast, and the trog would definitely be useful, I think what you have here is just a big fun romp and stomp. I think if I ever build a troglodon I am going for the Bradifer list just to give it a try.

 

I built my list because I like Dinosaurs, and generally dislike hordes of foot troops.

I don't care for Guard in general.
They're either super strong unkilable defensive blob, that loses hard to mortal wounds, and hero sniping.
Or you just slowly crush everyone you play against and it's a defensive bubble, not a whole lot of decision making going on there. (You can't get past this circle unless you kill the heroes/have mortal wounds. Good luck)

It's a bummer that's one of our better tactics because as discussed, it's stupidly easy to use, but genuinely static and lacking real progressive tactics/decisions.

Your list tosses out monsters for a bunch of foot troops and non-OP guard. If you like footmen, go for it! Certainly more casual.
As I said I just prefer monsters, that's the only reason I picked Seraphon

 

Same I love the thunderquake starhost!

But the group I visited got salty I destroyed their best player's team, plus I want an casual army against not that strong/non-competetive players. So I thought having foot troops would mean he'd get to kill some even if he lost.

So like the guy who lost put it: "he'd feel like he played".

 

Oh, but I'm totally going to try your build as well I love it! it is a nice combo between ranged and melee.

 

Oh, quick question. If I take the spears, and I have range 2", does that mean that if the enemy is still locked with my guards (10 guards up front, behind them are the warriors, protected) I can move them forward in such a way that my warriors can attack the enemy from behind my guard? And if the enemy has range 1", does that mean they can't attack my warriors? (I can't use their bite attack as well ofcourse).

 

That is correct.

 

Yep but that only woks defensively.
_ 10_-G_U_A_R_D-_ _
0-10-W_A_R_R_I_O_R_S-
19-20-W_A_R_R_I_O_R_S-

Enemy charges your guard and piles in.
X_X_X_X_X_X_X_X_X_X_X_X
X_X _10 _-G_U_A_R_D-_ _ X_X
0-10-W_A_R_R_I_O_R_S-
19-20-W_A_R_R_I_O_R_S-

Warriors 0-10 can attack back because of 2" range.

However if you are on the offense, your warriors would be unable to complete the charge unless they can reach base-to-base.

So if the guards already charged a target like this:
G = Guard

G_X_X_X_X_X_X_X_X_X_G
_G _ 10_-G_U_A_R_D-_ G_
1 "
2"
3"
4"
5"
0-10-W_A_R_R_I_O_R_S-
19-20-W_A_R_R_I_O_R_S-

Warriors need a bi charge, past the guards, and into Base-to-Base. So probably 7-8 inch charge to get one in B2B.

 

Well the Warriors are there to take in the charge should the enemy be able to charge in first. Like a shield wall. Otherwise the warriors will go in first (and I will buff them first with mythic shield and starlight instead of the guards).

So basically the warriors charge in first, and if there is room the guards will as well, or they will be a second line between the enemy and the Slann and Starpriest and the Cavalry+scar veterans on dino's.

The reason I'll be able to do that even after they charge into my guards first, is because with the Oldblood's command I can reform my units within 10 inch of the Oldblood, as long as they are 3 inch away from the enemy troops. So either I can keep my guards against the enemy line, and put my cavalry (with move 7) 3 inch behind the enemy, and then move over them (4 inch, so I position them in an area behind the thinnest line of the enemy). Unless I have to end the move 3 inch behind the enemy line as well? If so, would it be possible to charge over them?

Also, should I decide to go in with the guards first, won't the Slann's Command allow me to charge fly over the enemy line? As in, I charge towards the area behind their backline, and depending on how well I roll, I can attack both their backline, as well as any enemies that are right behind them?

 

It is my understanding that you charge on the ground.

You would need to fly/move over the enemies in movement phase, end 3" away, then turn around and charge.

 

So for that You need to move 6 inch, and then the thickness of the enemy's battleline?

If so, then I might need to change my tactics a bit. It means my cavalry won't be able to charge over them, even if I position them 3" from the enemy line with the help of my oldblood. So I will need to pull back my guards with the Oldblood's command, and then charge in with my warriors.

This is kind of a problem, since with this army I lack the long range capabilities to deal with overpowered weapons like Hellcanons.

 

Or if you can get 1 guard into base with a charge or just move them the next turn on pile in they can attack as long as they are in range. There are a lot of options as long as the warriors live.

 

What do you mean? get 1 guard into base? And when they pile in they can attack when they are in range?

 

Oh, and in addition to my previous questions, what do you both think of this army?

Bloodclaw Starhost= 100
Oldblood on Carnosaur= 320
Scar Veteran on Carnosaur= 260
Oldblood= 100
Sunblood= 120
Unit of 30 Saurus Warriors= 300
Unit of 10 Saurus warriors= 100
Unit of 10 Saurus warriors= 100

Slann Starmage= 260
Hurricanum= 320

Total = 1980 (So Triumph on one of the heroes or units).

I'm a bit irky about this idea, because it only takes one casualty to my 30 stack Warrior unit to remove it's extra spear attack. And the 2 units of 10 warriors won't be as tanky as the guards to take on the hits. But in exchange I will have the Hurricanum: Which will give a +1 on all hit rolls (including bite attacks), and together with the Oldblood on Carnosaur they will be able to deal a decent amount of range damage to their opponents.

Tomorrow my little brother is coming over and while I'm on vacation he will make a headstart with the painting of some of our miniatures. So I want to make sure we have the best possible "casual" army. One that provides a challenge, but is still decent to fight against. What do you think about this one?

 

Yes, chatlrge with the guard first, you only need to have one model within half an inch for the charfe to count, then charge in with the warriors, on the pile in phase your guard still move three inches ti the closest enemy model. Or charge with your warriors and the on the next turn move the guard behind them, then pile in and attack. Though you have more than enough opportunity to leave room between the warriors so that the guard can get the charge on the same turn.

 

Alright, thanks!

On my last army, I was thinking about charging in with my 2 units of 10 warriors, and then position my unit of 30 warriors with spears behind them, and more then 1" away, so the enemy 1" units can't hit them. Is that possible? Or do I really have to move my unit of 30 warriors as close as possible as well?

Also, I just realised something: If I use the Scar veteran on Carnosaur his command: https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos-warscroll-veterancarnosaur-en.pdf do I also get the extra attack if I roll a 5, and I add the +1 from the Hurricanum? After all, it does say if you roll a 6 or more!

 

I don't think you can include "Celestial Hurricanum" and "Casual" in the same list.

Hurricanum is awesome and everything, but force wide multiplier buffs and mortal wound spamming every turn is certainly the way you table somebody in a casual game.