8th Ed. LoS and flyers

[VampTeddy]

Now it seems most people are covering / hiding their flyers behind units to deny LoS.

I'd like to ask how and why this is possible?

Under flyers in the BRB it's stated that flyers sometimes can see more than a regular unit due to their altitude on the base.

Am i missing something here?

I'd say LoS to and from flyers goes from their position on the base, as nothing else is stated anywhere in the BRB - yes it is stated they land, HOWEVER it is also stated (as mentioned before) they can see more due to their position and altitude on the base.

 

[Lizardmatt]

You draw line of sight from the models eyes to the body of the model.

Sticking a unit behind another unit does not automatically block line of sight; it actually would have to be out of sight.

-Matt

 

[VampTeddy]

You draw line of sight from the models eyes to the body of the model.

Sticking a unit behind another unit does not automatically block line of sight; it actually would have to be out of sight.

-Matt

Thanks a lot!

I meant the same is true, but it's just that i have seen contradicting posts.

Wouldn't this also mean that ripper dactyls (for instance) are not much safer behind your own units? Offc there's distance to be considered, but unless they block part of the model, there's no penalty to hit, right?

 

[hdctambien]

Wouldn't this also mean that ripper dactyls (for instance) are not much safer behind your own units? Offc there's distance to be considered, but unless they block part of the model, there's no penalty to hit, right?

I'm not 100% sure if this is still how the flier rule is written, but it used to be the case that fliers "landed" at the end of each movement phase, so they were assumed to be on the ground (that is why they can be charged by non-fliers).

As far as I know, only Large Targets don't get the soft cover penalty for being behind units. (I usually have the book handy to double check these things...)

 

[VampTeddy]

Wouldn't this also mean that ripper dactyls (for instance) are not much safer behind your own units? Offc there's distance to be considered, but unless they block part of the model, there's no penalty to hit, right?

I'm not 100% sure if this is still how the flier rule is written, but it used to be the case that fliers "landed" at the end of each movement phase, so they were assumed to be on the ground (that is why they can be charged by non-fliers).

As far as I know, only Large Targets don't get the soft cover penalty for being behind units. (I usually have the book handy to double check these things...)

Their LoS is explicitly stated to be from their altitude (still eyes to modem) which means they're aloft at LoS sightings.

And shooting at units requires full line of sight or penalty

it's quite hard to cover up a flier with another unit.

It does only state LoS from the flier though, but i assume the reverse counts as well.

 

[hdctambien]

it's quite hard to cover up a flier with another unit

I think you're totally right. It looks like I was remembering the Flying rule from 6th or 7th edition. I don't see anything in the 8th book about the Flyer landing between movement phases.

Being behind another unit does protect them from being charged (by non-fliers), but that probably isn't a big deal on turn 1. (It would probably be better to put the fliers in front of the non-flying unit with some rocks "flocking" the Flyer's base)

 

[rychek]

Pg 70 of the BRB states flyers start their movement on the ground and end on the ground. It also states that depending on the model's height, it may be possible to declare a charge over the top of another unit.

What I get out of that is that 8th edition Line of Sight only takes into consideration the way the unit is physically modeled for the purpose of "seeing". If your Rippers (for example) are behind a unit of saurus and their entire bodies are visible from across the table, they are not in cover and receive zero benefit from enemy shooting due to cover.

Edit: added relevant info.

 

[Screamer]

Another example of the iffyness of TLoS... As you stated it matters how you build your model. If you use a short flying pole it's easier to gain hard cover. Heck, if you model your flyers standing on their hind legs with the wings spread they would get the benefit from seeing over your units (since they get quite tall) and get hard cover since your unit is blocking line of sigjt to your flyers.

It will look strange, but... I don't like TLoS for this particular reason. I shouldn't be punished or gain an advantage depending on how I glue the models together. Or if i put boulders on the bases.

 

[godswearhats]

I think that people put their fliers behind other units not to block LoS but to block charges, to make the range longer and to allow the charge over the unit in order to control combat. I've not played against anyone who has tried to say that a flier has cover behind their unit. Of course, YMMV. (Your Meta May Vary).