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Malign Portents

NIGHTBRINGER said:
Yes she does... you can see all the skeletons at here feet. Since this Malign Portents is based on a death theme, it is logical to conclude that her enemies were undead/skeletons!
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They don't look like they fought her though, they just look like the random corpses laying around in any death realm. None have wounds, or even weapons.
 
johan-grenier-sketches-09.jpg


Seems like the Gobbos, Stormcast and Darkoths are fighting side by side.
 
Canas said:
they just look like the random corpses laying around in any death realm
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Just hanging out? Now you know why they are laying about... defeated by the might of Chaos.

Canas said:
None have wounds, or even weapons.
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None that you can see. We only see a small section of the ground as much of it is covered in mist. That skeleton in the lower left corner does look like it was approaching her.
Captaniser said:
johan-grenier-sketches-09.jpg


Seems like the Gobbos, Stormcast and Darkoths are fighting side by side.
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They should all be fighting side by side against the SCE.
 
I can sort of imagine Destruction and Order temporarily stopping fighting each other if the situation makes it necessary, but Demon worshippers?
Under certain circumstances I would even say temporary cooperation with Death would be more likely than with Chaos. Death is some kind of order at least, so to speak.
 
NIGHTBRINGER said:
They should all be fighting side by side against the SCE.
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that one looks way better than these individual ones for the SCE and demon one.


Aginor said:
I can sort of imagine Destruction and Order temporarily stopping fighting each other if the situation makes it necessary, but Demon worshippers?
Under certain circumstances I would even say temporary cooperation with Death would be more likely than with Chaos. Death is some kind of order at least, so to speak.
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I could imagine a tzeentch or skaven force temporarly allying. Or at least, I could if they actually wrote the bad guys as more than randomly violent for the sake of violence bad guys.... Khorne forces barely understand the concept of allies, so they won't work, nurgle is too demonic even for his most normal followers, and slaanesh too insane. But a tzeentch sorceror should be more than willing to team up with well, anyone really, if it means a fun game or acces to some knowledge or artifact or some such. Idem with skaven, except with more backstabbing. Also the SCE seem to have far too much of a stick up their ass to consider allying, which does rather ruin it.
 
Hmmmm well in the Lore for Silver Tower there is actually a bit of background why a Darkoath Chieftain or a Tzeentch Sorcerer fights there along with the Order, Destruction and Death heroes, so yeah it isn't completely unheard of.
 
Aginor said:
Hmmmm well in the Lore for Silver Tower there is actually a bit of background why a Darkoath Chieftain or a Tzeentch Sorcerer fights there along with the Order, Destruction and Death heroes, so yeah it isn't completely unheard of.
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Those are individuals though, and there's more for them to gain by stabbing the gaunt summoner than there is by stabbing a random figure they meet in the tower for mere moments. And on top of that they only see eachother for moments as the moment one of em wanders of he'l be lost in the labyrinth again. It's no so much working together as much as it was just stabbing the highest threat and their normal enemies dissappearing before they could actually turn on eachother.

Though yea, at least it gives some precedent. Especially for the ones we know are willing to scheme or ally. As a quick guess on willingness to ally:
  • Any order guy: allies whenever possible or needed. Provided he doesn't have too much a stick up his ass to deal with the "shame" of allying with an enemy (e.g. SCE I'd expect to basicly never ally with chaos, or death for that matter given that they "steal" souls of the SCE... but a seraphon could say ally with a cabal of weak tzeentch sourcerers to take out a demon prince of khorne or something as ultimatly that means less chaos in the world so a step closer to the plan.)
  • Destruction: allies provided the ally can bribe him (a good fight, food, shiny stuff), the more scheming ones like grots might ally if they can see profit in it without needing to be bribed. They might also just ally on a whim or by some basic subterfuge. E.g "O glorious orruk chieftan, that vampire over there said he'd kick your ass, are you going to let him say that?" probably insticates a waaaaagh against said vampire...
  • Death: pretty much the same as order, except that they probably don't care about mortal enemies as much, so they won't have as much a problem with allying with chaos. Possible only exception being nurgle given that they break his cycle.
  • Chaos:
    • Tzeentch: allies provided it is more interesting, or gives acces to knowledge or some artifact.
    • Slaanesh: too insane for anyone to want to ally with them with their obsession with excessive torture and rape and such. Maaaaybe death might ally as skeletons won't care much about torture. But that's about it really...
    • Nurgle: might ally if absolutly needed, but will probably avoid it. Plus with them being walking deseases noone is really capable of allying with em apart from undeath and again, fairly certain those two can't stand eachother
    • Khorne: lol what's an ally? Skulls for the skullthrone... seriously, any follower of khorne willing to ally would probably be smitten by khorne himself...
    • Skaven: they'l ally with anyone, and then backstab him 5 seconds after... admittadly, plenty of fools will be willing to ally with em thinking they can backstab em first..
    • beastman: given that their whole deal is that they want to murder everything that's vaguely sentient they're not going to ally...
    • General slaves to darkness: might ally, especially when not following a specific god yet. They're mostly just kinda creepy dudes, so they're sorta "fine".
So meh, a bunch are definitly capable of allying. Even some quite weird combinations. But they're going to need to come up with some decent explenations for it as simply saying "sigmar said you'd have to ally with me otherwise he's going to punch gork n mork/nagash/your boss" would be a tad lame...
 
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Aginor said:
I can sort of imagine Destruction and Order temporarily stopping fighting each other if the situation makes it necessary, but Demon worshippers?
Under certain circumstances I would even say temporary cooperation with Death would be more likely than with Chaos. Death is some kind of order at least, so to speak.
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Labeling the entire Destruction alliance together is simplifying it a bit. Orkz/Orruks don't care about allies that much. Maybe if the allies can help them crump a bigger foe, other than that, not much. Goblins are opportunistic backstabbers, if they feel they can't win a fight, they'll ally with close to anyone, until an opportunity arises to backstab their friends. Ogres aren't that bad actually. They like eating and money, so they often get hired s mercenary's by other Order armies. Hell, some Ogres even work in the Cities of Sigmar.

Death and Order used to be close allies, then Sigmar made the Stormcast.


Canas said:
  • Any order guy: allies whenever possible or needed. Provided he doesn't have too much a stick up his ass to deal with the "shame" of allying with an enemy (e.g. SCE I'd expect to basicly never ally with chaos, or death for that matter given that they "steal" souls of the SCE...

  • Skaven: they'l ally with anyone, and then backstab him 5 seconds after... admittadly, plenty of fools will be willing to ally with em thinking they can backstab em first..
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It's the other way around. Whenever a Stormcast is created, a soul is "stolen" from Nagash. That's why Nagash has such a bone to pick with Sigmar.

Skaven, like Goblins, will ally if they feel like it gives them some sort of leverge. They will still backstab you the second they get a chance, when they feel that the imminent danger has gone away.
 
Captaniser said:
Labeling the entire Destruction alliance together is simplifying it a bit. Orkz/Orruks don't care about allies that much. Maybe if the allies can help them crump a bigger foe, other than that, not much. Goblins are opportunistic backstabbers, if they feel they can't win a fight, they'll ally with close to anyone, until an opportunity arises to backstab their friends. Ogres aren't that bad actually. They like eating and money, so they often get hired s mercenary's by other Order armies. Hell, some Ogres even work in the Cities of Sigmar.
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I meant that with "they can be bribed, and the more scheming ones might actually try to take advantage and activly seek out allies". Ogres work for the cities cuz the cities give em a bunch of food, much easier tastier and more food than they can get on their on. Orruks can be "bribed" by offering a better fight. Destruction tends to function on basic whims and urges, so provided you can somehow bribe em they'l probably join you for a while. The moment you can no longer bribe em they'l probably turn on you though seeing as most of them aren't that civil (with the exception of the more civil ogres as it'd ruin their chances of a new contract)

Also, it should even be possible to just subjugate a greenskin tribe as a tributary if you can show em who's boss and then consitently offer them good opponents to fight.

Captaniser said:
Death and Order used to be close allies, then Sigmar made the Stormcast.
It's the other way around. Whenever a Stormcast is created, a soul is "stolen" from Nagash. That's why Nagash has such a bone to pick with Sigmar..
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You really going to think stormcasts will admit to that? Plus, apart from Nagash himself, and maybe some of his closest luitenants no necromancer is going to really care much about that. If the SCE can be a usefull tool for them they'l use em as allies. And even Nagash himself probably wouldn't refuse to "ally" with a minor SCE force to defeat a greater threat. Hell, he'd probably even ally with sigmar if he doesn't have a choice or thinks he might be able to pick up some "lost souls" in the midst of battle (after all, who will notice a couple more dead SCE).

The stormcasts however with their stick up their butt are probably going to refuse to work with any necromancer on account of them having raised a SCE corpse, or that of a friend of a brother of a cousin of a nephew of the dog of their grandma, somewhere along the way and that's total sacrilige and all such. God the stormforged need some actual decent personality apart from just unflinching masked and armoured angels of vengeance... Who came up with having them progressivly losing their personality each reforging, it removes so many possibilities for interesting stuff...


Captaniser said:
Skaven, like Goblins, will ally if they feel like it gives them some sort of leverge. They will still backstab you the second they get a chance, when they feel that the imminent danger has gone away.
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Did I not say that?
 
Man I hope they fix the Deathlords, Deathmages and Nighthaunt problems with the new book. Outside of a Grand Alliance Death army it is so hard to combine those nicely.
 
Aginor said:
Man I hope they fix the Deathlords, Deathmages and Nighthaunt problems with the new book. Outside of a Grand Alliance Death army it is so hard to combine those nicely.
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Meh, that goes for most old stuff. Skaven, the entirety of death, the former empire, the former elves; they're all divided into subfactions that don't actually form an army for no good reason.
 
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