8th Ed. mass Razordons and ranks

[warlorddrax]

if i were to run a unit of 8 Razordons...

2 ranks of 4 razordons with skink handlers lining up behind them.

A) do all razordons get to fire as normal? even the ones in the second rank?

B) do i get rank bonuses for the skinks and razordons?

formation is as follows:
R = Razordon
S = Skink

R R R R
R R R R
ssssssss
ssssssss
ssssssss

in theory, i could cast the + D3 spell and murder entire units with this in one round of shooting.
it would also be a terrifying formation for the enemy to charge because of all of the stand and shoot.

now, another question (i'm new to 8th...)

my opponent declares all charges. then moves models right?
so i can pick what i get to stand and shoot against?
would i be able to add a Sarus Hero BSB with the armor piercing banner to the unit?

i'm sure that there are more... but that is all i have for now.

thanks!!!

 

[Lizardmatt]

All units can shoot in 2 ranks. You use the line of sight from the front model to determine line of sight from the 2nd rank.

You must choose to stand and fire. Opponents declare charges one at a time, and you must declare a reaction before your opponent declares his next charge. This means, you will ALWAYS stand and fire against the first opponent that can charge you. Since you can only stand and fire once, you're free to choose any reaction you want for the 2nd charge (such as flee).

You cannot attach characters to Salamanders or Razordon (it's in their rules).

If you do get armor piercing on the unit (via the lore of metal enchanted blade spell), bad news; it only affects close combat attacks. Armor piercing states that models with the armor piercing rule have armor piercing close combat attacks. Weapon with the armor piercing rule have armor piercing with any attack made with that weapon.

The augment that gives bonus BS does affect the whole unit. Making the unit BS 5 or BS6 results in you slaughtering anything you point them at.

-Matt

 

[Qupakoco]

B) do i get rank bonuses for the skinks and razordons?

Razordons are Skirmishers. Skirmishers can never claim a rank bonus.

 

[warlorddrax]

thanks for the quick replies!

that clears up a lot of things for me!

 

[spawning of Bob]

If there were 3 unis likely to charge, you could hold for the non scary ones and stand and shoot for those likely to smash you, or whomight panic from your hits.

For 3 charges, you could hold, then shoot, then flee if desired.

 

[Lizardmatt]

If there were 3 unis likely to charge, you could hold for the non scary ones and stand and shoot for those likely to smash you, or whomight panic from your hits.

For 3 charges, you could hold, then shoot, then flee if desired.

That's incorrect.
You're opponent declares his first charge, and you must choose your reaction. You're forced to choose to stand and shoot before you even know that a 2nd or 3rd unit is also charging.
Because you actually process the stand and shoot before your opponent declares his next charge, you have already shot by the time you get the 2nd charge declared against you.


-Matt

 

[MI_Tiger]

You do have to resolve charge reactions one at a time, completing one reaction before the next charge is declared. However, you do NOT have to declare stand-and-shoot against the first charge. Page 18 of the basic rule book gives the example of a unit that Holds against the first charge, Stands-and-shoots against the second, and Flees from a third. The only restrictions are that you can only stand-and-shoot once per phase, and if you flee once you must continue to flee from all additional charges.

Note that if you do choose to hold against the first charge, you are taking a risk that your opponent won't declare the second charge that you are expecting. If you don't shoot first, you may not get a chance to shoot at all.

 

[Madrck]

Razordons have the Instinctive Defense special rule. Have to stand and shoot if charged, so your opponent can force you to stand and shoot with his first charge, you can then flee if he charges a second time as stand and shoot is no longer an option.

 

[Mahtis]

You do have to resolve charge reactions one at a time, completing one reaction before the next charge is declared. However, you do NOT have to declare stand-and-shoot against the first charge. Page 18 of the basic rule book gives the example of a unit that Holds against the first charge, Stands-and-shoots against the second, and Flees from a third. The only restrictions are that you can only stand-and-shoot once per phase, and if you flee once you must continue to flee from all additional charges.

Note that if you do choose to hold against the first charge, you are taking a risk that your opponent won't declare the second charge that you are expecting. If you don't shoot first, you may not get a chance to shoot at all.

This works for everything except for razordons. The reason is the rules:" If charged, a Razordon hunting pack MUST stand and shoot if it is able to do so". That's what Lizardmatt mean I think.

 

[Lizardmatt]

You do have to resolve charge reactions one at a time, completing one reaction before the next charge is declared. However, you do NOT have to declare stand-and-shoot against the first charge. Page 18 of the basic rule book gives the example of a unit that Holds against the first charge, Stands-and-shoots against the second, and Flees from a third. The only restrictions are that you can only stand-and-shoot once per phase, and if you flee once you must continue to flee from all additional charges.

Note that if you do choose to hold against the first charge, you are taking a risk that your opponent won't declare the second charge that you are expecting. If you don't shoot first, you may not get a chance to shoot at all.

This works for everything except for razordons. The reason is the rules:" If charged, a Razordon hunting pack MUST stand and shoot if it is able to do so". That's what Lizardmatt mean I think.

Exactly.

 

[spawning of Bob]

Oops . I will never taunt a razordon again!

 

[MI_Tiger]

My mistake. I was talking about general rules - forgot this thread was about Razordons specifically.

 

[Caneghem]

All units can shoot in 2 ranks. You use the line of sight from the front model to determine line of sight from the 2nd rank.

You must choose to stand and fire. Opponents declare charges one at a time, and you must declare a reaction before your opponent declares his next charge. This means, you will ALWAYS stand and fire against the first opponent that can charge you. Since you can only stand and fire once, you're free to choose any reaction you want for the 2nd charge (such as flee).

You cannot attach characters to Salamanders or Razordon (it's in their rules).

If you do get armor piercing on the unit (via the lore of metal enchanted blade spell), bad news; it only affects close combat attacks. Armor piercing states that models with the armor piercing rule have armor piercing close combat attacks. Weapon with the armor piercing rule have armor piercing with any attack made with that weapon.

The augment that gives bonus BS does affect the whole unit. Making the unit BS 5 or BS6 results in you slaughtering anything you point them at.

-Matt

I'd disagree on one point... Enchanted Blades of Aiban doesn't say "grants the unit the armour piercing rule" but rather it says "all of their attacks count as magical and have the Armour Piercing special rule." So if a shooting attack is a type of attack, I'd say they too gain AP.