Discussion in 'Seraphon Discussion' started by Logan8054, Jan 28, 2019.
thats a fat rip, looking forward to them lol
Possibly delayed longer then that. Shipping costs have gone nuts in general, and apparently GW is having pricing issues with suppliers.
New batch of updates. Cogs nerfed to the ground, pinned by two units with touching bases no longer prevents movement in pile-in, all abilities that negate wounds or mortals seem to be now called Wards and only one roll is allowed (if I am not mistaken in understanding?) and Sylvaneth update brought nothing where I expected to see a fix of their missing teleport ability on the Wildwoods.
EDIT: The Sylvaneth update is a stealthy one to me, they just removed the line saying that the teleport is on the terrain instead of the allegiance ability, so I guess their teleport now works again.
Yeah, I assumed GW would eventually change things like the Astrolith to being a ward save. Cogs sort of goes back to just affecting one caster like it did in 2.0, yes? Still lame though.
under the new wording of the faq on wards, would selfless protector still let guard get a ward save ? im leaning to yes because the wording is that the wound isnt negated, just the allocation is changed? what do you guys think
Wording is such that you MUST allocate that wound the the Guard. Ward saves are taken before allocation. At least if my groggy self is remembering correctly after the Ward Whiplash
At least they fixed stuff. Bummed that Guard can't take a ward save against the damage they intercept.
But it is what it is.
Well, the ward roll is made before the wound is allocated, so for now the astrolith bearer still stacks
Erta and wizardlizard released their new vid on YouTube and discussed this. Bodyguard saves do not get ward saves I guess
Does this address the Astrolith Bearer? If so, it effectively makes the Astrolith Bearer hand out ward saves.
I wish they would have added more to the answer aside from just "Yes".
IMO Revifying works 100% and is not a ward.
Core Rules: Wards happen before the wound is allocated
the new FAQ don't modify the timing of wards. they still happen before the wound is allocated, FAQ specifies that similar abilities are wards too
what is the ability used as example in the FAQ? let's read it:
Yeah, it triggers before you allocate a wound. As Wards work.
now, let's take a look at the Astrolith Bearer: it triggers when you allocate the wound. not before.
I think the intent is pretty clear that GW wants only one roll and anything that seems similar to a damage prevention roll is now a ward save. Unfortunately they're exceedingly incompetent when it comes to writing clear and consistent rules and instead of elaborating they simply wrote "yes" in the faq. The problem is there's several different wordings for what's effectively the same thing, but they've only addressed one specific wording. I know TO's are all ruling that you get one ward save, period. And we all know what is intended to be ward saves, so I'm not going to play with ward stacking of any sort.
that's true, but GW it's also exceptionally inconsistent with all the rules that go toward a certain direction, then a new model comes out and break those same principles.
True, but the question answered asked if abilities that negate wounds and MW are Wards.
The last sentence of Revivifying Engines states that it can negate Wounds and MW.
Seems cut and dry.
Edit: That would mean that the timing does change as it is a ward. Its a warscroll from last edition among many that was not FAQ'd but clearly was meant to be included.
I was focusing on timing because the core rules says that wards happen before allocation, but you may be right.
The effects of those abilities are the same.
Here is my thought process. In the new FAQ under the errata section wards are defined as follows.
14.3 – Wards
Replace the paragraph with the following:
‘Some abilities allow you to roll a dice to negate a wound or mortal
wound. Abilities of this type are referred to as wards, and the dice
roll is referred to as a ward roll. Unless stated otherwise, the ward
roll is made before the wound is allocated to the model in question.
Up to 1 ward roll can be made for each wound or mortal wound. If
the ward roll is successful, the wound or mortal wound is negated
and has no effect on the model.
So astrolith bearer's revivifying energies would follow the bold part of stating otherwise that the ward would be applied when allocated and not before.
The question on the FAQ about wards was as follows
Q: If a player makes a successful dice roll to negate a wound or mortal
wound, and this triggers an effect that forces a wound or mortal
wound to be allocated to a different unit (as per, for example, ‘Sworn
Protectors’ in Battletome: Fyreslayers or ‘The Armour of Morkar’ in
Battletome: Slaves to Darkness), can an attempt be made to negate
that additional wound or mortal wound if an effect would allow a
player to do so?
A: No. Wounds and mortal wounds allocated in this way cannot
Since selfless protectors does not negate the wound or mortal wound itself, and instead only changes allocations, this ruling does not apply to it. So you would change the wound allocation to the saurus guard, who would then apply the ward save from the astrolith bearer because the ward granted by the bearer follows a different timing rule.
At least thats how it seems to work to me Rules as Written.
Afraid not. RAW in the FAQ says otherwise if you read the full text and use it in full. It clearly says you've negated it from the first unit by putting it on the second. One roll.
Lots of people have looked at it and it's pretty clear. Bodyguard rules are psuedo-wards. At least that's the intent from my understanding.
Edit: but I'd be happy if we could still save Slann with Guards and fnp guards. I'm tired, and a bit dejected when it comes to GW rules writing.
To me, it is greatly obvious that the new Ward rule encompasses both our Astrolith, and all the other abilities of that ilk.
I believe it's meant to, but I can also see that according to RAW you could argue that the language allows it to work after passing wounds to guards. I'm guessing some people will keep using the rule the way we have been doing up till now, but it will probably be FAQ'd at some point.
My question is just why make this weird specification where only the fyreslayers bodyguard save doesn't work? What's the point?
Gw trying to make things intentionally difficult for their players?