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AoS NEW *rumor*

I'm really confused at reading some of these posts, have you actually read the End Times book you're referencing? Kroq-Gar was never poisoned. He was briefly affected by the plague fumes that came out of Lord Skrolk's Rod of Corruption, but that was purified through the power of the Hand of the Gods. He was also again briefly affected by the vomit spewed by the Verminlord Vermalanx the Corrupt but was able to once more shrug that off through the Gauntlet's power. It didn't actually say anywhere that the Hand of the Gods gave him any sort of power beyond the ability to survive two attacks that had respectively killed a fullgrown Carnosaur and a whole regiment of Temple Guards, certainly not to the point of Godhood.

His fate was not explained. The last mention of him was that he was atop a new Carnosaur and headed towards the Temple-City that was leaving the planet; whether he made it onto it or what happened after he did is unmentioned.

Is it possible he's alive? Definitely, he can't have died of old age and there's been no mention of him falling in battle. But more likely is that he's just been written out because GW are shoddy writers who make bad decisions.
 
Lium said:
It didn't actually say anywhere that the Hand of the Gods gave him any sort of power beyond the ability to survive two attacks that had respectively killed a fullgrown Carnosaur and a whole regiment of Temple Guards, certainly not to the point of Godhood.
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Godhood is a tricky thing. I mean all our Slann are practically gods, but are not called so, while the gods in AOS are just beings infused with a bit of stray magic, while gods of the old world seemed to just be there based on how many believed in them.
How can some of them be gods while others aren't? How is Kroak not a god (maybe he actually is, I don't know).
Who's to say Kroq-Gar did not ascend to some sort of godhood, it's not like there seems to be too much consistency in that field anyway, and if he's anything like the Slann and sunbloods and still alive, he's likely even more powerful now, than in the old world.

Personally I would love the idea of him still being alive, since he's my favorite character. Realistically though it seems to me that he is not, but that he is vaguely remembered by most of the Slann, hence all the saurus leader names being so close to his.
 
ASSASSIN_NR_1 said:
Godhood is a tricky thing. I mean all our Slann are practically gods, but are not called so, while the gods in AOS are just beings infused with a bit of stray magic, while gods of the old world seemed to just be there based on how many believed in them.
How can some of them be gods while others aren't? How is Kroak not a god (maybe he actually is, I don't know).
Who's to say Kroq-Gar did not ascend to some sort of godhood, it's not like there seems to be too much consistency in that field anyway, and if he's anything like the Slann and sunbloods and still alive, he's likely even more powerful now, than in the old world.

Personally I would love the idea of him still being alive, since he's my favorite character. Realistically though it seems to me that he is not, but that he is vaguely remembered by most of the Slann, hence all the saurus leader names being so close to his.
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What constitues a god has always been vague in Warhammer, but 2 of the key characteristics of godhood has always been worship by a race (Khaine, Sigmar, Horned rat, Old ones) or being a primordial force (Khorne, Nurgle, Tzeentch and Slaanesh). The gods also used to be untouchable and distant with limited effects on the world, besides the primordial forces.

Gods in AoS are much more anthromorphic and active in the realms. But what constitues a god in AoS? Inherent Power, Sigmar was all powerful when he arrived in the realms with no worshippers, and he doesn't seem that more powerful in the current timeline than before he was the storm god. Worship, Khaine is dead, sort of, but Morathi uses his heart to siphon his worship into herself in an effort to become a full god. Willpower, Alerialle was at the brink of losing the realm of life and all her people, but through sheer force of will she was reborn more powerful than ever. Because you can? Nagash landed in Shyish where plenty of other Death gods existed, but he wanted to be THE god of death so he consumed all in his path.

Death of a god is also a weird thing, since 3 dead gods, Khaine, Kurnous and Grimnir, still have a lasting effect on the realms. Grimnir's urgold that contain his essence, Khaine's heart that can reveive him if more shards of him return and Kurnous that can be temporarily brought back to life by Alerialle.
 
Captaniser said:
What constitues a god has always been vague in Warhammer, but 2 of the key characteristics of godhood has always been worship by a race (Khaine, Sigmar, Horned rat, Old ones) or being a primordial force (Khorne, Nurgle, Tzeentch and Slaanesh). The gods also used to be untouchable and distant with limited effects on the world, besides the primordial forces.

Gods in AoS are much more anthromorphic and active in the realms. But what constitues a god in AoS? Inherent Power, Sigmar was all powerful when he arrived in the realms with no worshippers, and he doesn't seem that more powerful in the current timeline than before he was the storm god. Worship, Khaine is dead, sort of, but Morathi uses his heart to siphon his worship into herself in an effort to become a full god. Willpower, Alerialle was at the brink of losing the realm of life and all her people, but through sheer force of will she was reborn more powerful than ever. Because you can? Nagash landed in Shyish where plenty of other Death gods existed, but he wanted to be THE god of death so he consumed all in his path.

Death of a god is also a weird thing, since 3 dead gods, Khaine, Kurnous and Grimnir, still have a lasting effect on the realms. Grimnir's urgold that contain his essence, Khaine's heart that can reveive him if more shards of him return and Kurnous that can be temporarily brought back to life by Alerialle.
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From that I would then say that there aren't any true gods in AOS, and maybe there never were any true gods at all. Seems more like some strong kind of energies are at play, and these energies can in a way possess beings, making them very powerful and into what is considered a god.
Really I guess this was true in the old world as well then, the energies were just not directed at a being as such, but more of an idea, and then of course if someone were to be linked to the idea they might become a god. But that's just a theory, a... okay I'll stop myself there.
 
ASSASSIN_NR_1 said:
From that I would then say that there aren't any true gods in AOS, and maybe there never were any true gods at all. Seems more like some strong kind of energies are at play, and these energies can in a way possess beings, making them very powerful and into what is considered a god.
Really I guess this was true in the old world as well then, the energies were just not directed at a being as such, but more of an idea, and then of course if someone were to be linked to the idea they might become a god. But that's just a theory, a... okay I'll stop myself there.
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There's currently a thing about gods spread out over a couple of white dwarfs. You got two different types:

- Elemental gods; the chaos gods, but also gorkamorka and the various other gods that just exist (e.g. all those gods Nagash ate cuz that's a thing now…)
- Ascended gods: Sigmar, Teclis, Nagash, Grimnir etc. so gods who started out as a regular mortal and through some way method ascended into godhood.

Elemental gods seem to be influenced by worship to a relativly great extend causing their powers to grow or shrink over time depending on their influence. Ascended gods seem to have a more stable powerbase as once whatever thing is done that caused their ascension they seem to remain at that level indefinitly unless they ascend further (again, Nagash eating gods…) or would somehow be kicked down a peg or two by someone stealing their power.
Also, the elemental ones seem to Always start as abstract ideas that through believe and worship gained a life of their own. They're what would be the gods of the old world. The elemental ones start as regular humans/dwarves/elves/whatever and then someone sprinkles some super powerfull magic on them until they attain godhood.
 
Interesting thoughts about Gods here!

As for the Slann: they are so iconic, I'd be very sad if they were going.
 
To be honest, the slann are so integral to our faction that removing them would require reworking the entire faction. Sauri and skinks are spawned for specific purposes and more often than not are utterly terrible at any other task especially when that other task requires creativity and any snap decisions (with some noteable indivudal exceptions). Without the slann to provide guidance and most importantly to spawn the correct skinks and sauri at the right time the entire society would collapse. It's simply the case that far too few sauri/skinks are capable of doing something beyond the one specific task they were spawned for. So unless they simply say "there's a spawning with super independent and creative skinks to fill the void left by them" and that just feels lazy, especially without a lot of build-up. And one story about a slann dying is nowhere near enough buildup.
 
I’ll admit I hate the Lizardmen fluff and find that they really contradict themselves and don’t seem to have a clear storyline in mind. But there are some interesting things that they could do if they wanted to go from here.

Personally, my headcanon is this. I wrote it for fun one day thinking about how I wished the story would go:

The lizardmen leave the world that was in their space ships and begin to travel the stars. To save their forces all the lizardmen save the slanns and their skink attendants are put to sleep in cryo chambers. The slann are distraught over the end times and believe that they have failed the great plan. And so they travel the universe without purpose, learning many new Magic’s and truths until eventually they feel a pull towards a planet.

They land on the planet and discover it once belonged to their Old Ones. They activate a device that summons the image of an old one. For many of the remaining slann, this is the first time they have ever seen one and immediately they are overcome. The old one begins talking to the slann and the slann confess their failure. The old one is not upset and reassured the slann that they did not fail. That the end times was necessary, but had they been told, they may have tried to change it.

The old one then explains in their vast capacity to scry the future the old ones predicted the slann would arrive here and that he is a messenger sent to give them their new orders. He explains that the old ones are the ancient enemy of the true form of the chaos gods, and have warred with them since the beginning of time itself across many different dimensions and worlds. He explains that while the old ones are “one” the chaos gods exist in many forms across many realities. The gods we know are just one form and one part of a much more sinister and evil entity. This makes them much harder to destroy. However the hope is that by slowly destroying their forms 1 by 1, it will weaken the chaos gods enough to end them for all. This is the true great plan, to slowly weaken the chaos gods over trillions of years in order to finally end their great foe.

The slann now understand their purpose and eagerly accept their new task. The old one teaches the slann how to ascend the lizardmen to daemonhood, in order to help aid them in their quest. This process will take a very long time to complete, and while it works, the slann will be weakened and their army unusable. The slann summon the seraphon from their memories in order to aid them while the true lizardmen lie dormant in their cro-sleep. And so the seraphon begin traveling back to the world of age of sigmar, to kill the chaos gods.

The book would end with the slann weakened and exhausted, some dying from the effort, but successfull in their task. The true lizardmen awaken, more powerful and better in every way(way better rules) and join their seraphon brothers to wage war agains the forces of chaos and kill the chaos gods.
 
Canas said:
So unless they simply say "there's a spawning with super independent and creative skinks to fill the void left by them" and that just feels lazy, especially without a lot of build-up.
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At this point, not much can be lazier than "the Slann definitely exist, whether or not the rest of the Seraphon do is up to you, with the exception of those in one particular story".

Shoehorning Skinks in as the new leaders might be a bit rushed but at least it provides the faction with some direction. As it stands, we're headed by these immane and unknowable intelligences that don't seem to think much of anything except "Chaos bad" - a far cry from fleshed-out badasses like Mazda and Kroak.
 
PabloTho said:
At this point, not much can be lazier than "the Slann definitely exist, whether or not the rest of the Seraphon do is up to you, with the exception of those in one particular story".

Shoehorning Skinks in as the new leaders might be a bit rushed but at least it provides the faction with some direction. As it stands, we're headed by these immane and unknowable intelligences that don't seem to think much of anything except "Chaos bad" - a far cry from fleshed-out badasses like Mazda and Kroak.
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Yeah i agree. it would be nice if they gave at least some direction. As it stands it feels like the story was a rushed afterthought.
 
PabloTho said:
At this point, not much can be lazier than "the Slann definitely exist, whether or not the rest of the Seraphon do is up to you, with the exception of those in one particular story".

Shoehorning Skinks in as the new leaders might be a bit rushed but at least it provides the faction with some direction. As it stands, we're headed by these immane and unknowable intelligences that don't seem to think much of anything except "Chaos bad" - a far cry from fleshed-out badasses like Mazda and Kroak.
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Sunbloods exist as well. And it's been repeatedly stated that once summoned for a prolonged period of time they become as real as regularly spawned sauri/skinks.

And yeah, right now they mostly just need to do something with us.

Also, having slann skinks & saurus works well as it gives a nice layered structure to society with multiple castes and such. Making it just skinks & saurus is a lot less nice as you now have the saurus caste, who are the warriors and the skinks who are everything else. At least we slann you have the saurus as warriors, the slann as leaders and the skinks as the workers.
 
Canas said:
They're not a seperate caste though. At least not in the same way. Are they supposedd to be something seperate? Or just a bigger version of saurus?
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They are more workers than warriors closer to construction equipment than anything else. they only really fight as the last resort and have to have there weapons chained into there hand or they would drop them. then you aim them at the enamy and tell them to run. kind of like a dump truck with a mace
 
Erta Wanderer said:
They are more workers than warriors closer to construction equipment than anything else. they only really fight as the last resort and have to have there weapons chained into there hand or they would drop them. then you aim them at the enamy and tell them to run. kind of like a dump truck with a mace
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Don't they just go feral in combat? So a tad more sophisticated than said truck :p

Anyways my point was they're more similar to saurus than skinks (even if they are used as glorified construction equipment by the skinks) So I'm not sure if they're genuinly a seperate thing or just another breed of saurus that is just specific for a certain task.
 
Canas said:
Don't they just go feral in combat? So a tad more sophisticated than said truck :p

Anyways my point was they're more similar to saurus than skinks (even if they are used as glorified construction equipment by the skinks) So I'm not sure if they're genuinly a seperate thing or just another breed of saurus that is just specific for a certain task.
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i don't know they are definitely a different speacys from saurus being less intelligent twise the size and based on a different animal. huh if they are just big saurie then i want to see skink and slann variants now. maby a naga type skink or something aquatic.
 
They spawn in the same pools as and have a bond with Skinks. Visually they're closer to Saurus, depending on what interpretation you take, and mentally they are too, but they're still their own distinct category.
 
Lium said:
They spawn in the same pools as and have a bond with Skinks. Visually they're closer to Saurus, depending on what interpretation you take, and mentally they are too, but they're still their own distinct category.
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I like them and I am intrigued by them. I hope they soon get a rework so they are worth playing, too.
 
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