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AoS NEW *rumor*

Vallis said:
It's true that they have a weakness here. But I wonder how well they can quickly claim and hold objectives. With a wizard beamed to an objective and a defensive perimeter of Saurus Guard, Astrolith Bearer for ward and spell potency, skink bodies and debuffs, they may be pretty hard to clean off. A few units of 5 Guard around each wizard can absorb wounds and all of them can get replenished with Azure Light each turn. Meanwhile, mortal wounds from spells accumulate and summoned units keep joining the fight. I haven't tried this yet, but I'm not writing it off until I've tried it a few times. Obviously, the matchup could make a big difference.
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I hear what you are saying but I feel like if you are taking everything for Trog Bomb except the Trog Bomb. You have the skink wizards, the astrolith, the guard, all the "tax" units, but you aren't taking Kroak and I can't think of a better use of your points. You don't have to take the Trog as a skink starpriest can do the same job just without infinite range. But 12" from Kroak and 18" from the starpriest is still a 30" bubble to nuke with. If you also don't take the second Slann you have an extra 545 points to work with.
 
Lambs and Lions said:
I hear what you are saying but I feel like if you are taking everything for Trog Bomb except the Trog Bomb. You have the skink wizards, the astrolith, the guard, all the "tax" units, but you aren't taking Kroak and I can't think of a better use of your points. You don't have to take the Trog as a skink starpriest can do the same job just without infinite range. But 12" from Kroak and 18" from the starpriest is still a 30" bubble to nuke with. If you also don't take the second Slann you have an extra 545 points to work with.
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Agreed. It's not really a clearly defined list. It could have Kroak or a Starmaster, and it definitely can do a Trog-bomb-lite. It really is a list in the same spirit, but leans a little less into the magic so as to handle more diverse scenarios. It still would be a strong spellcaster list, and it should be: it's Starborne. It's focusing a bit more on survivability and still deals a lot of mortal wounds with spells. I think these could be legit ways to play Starborne that doesn't completely count on the Trog bomb.

I guess we'll see.
 
A Battle Shock battle report featuring Seraphon (Koatl's) vs. OBR (Petrifex).


They stop at the top of Round 4 and just do "Mathhammer" b/c Coalesced had not killed a single OBR model. Of course, this is just one video, but that's still not encouraging for Coalesced. The Seraphon player did cast the tricky Coalesced teleport spell.
 
Just A Skink said:
A Battle Shock battle report featuring Seraphon (Koatl's) vs. OBR (Petrifex).

They stop at the top of Round 4 and just do "Mathhammer" b/c Coalesced had not killed a single OBR model. Of course, this is just one video, but that's still not encouraging for Coalesced. The Seraphon player did cast the tricky Coalesced teleport spell.
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Not going to lie the seraphon player did not seem to know what he was doing. The list was just stuff they had in the studio already which is fine but it was not cohesive and had very little synergy which is what our army is all about. He forgot about the +1 to wound on the charge so it was like he didn't have a subfaction. And he also just was rolling poorly. The carnosaur didn't wound at all which is just bad luck and not a good representation of what it can do.

I would take this report with a huge grain of salt. Yes OBR is tough as nails but it just based on averages it shouldn't have been that bad.
 
Maybe with more poor Battle reports Like this the Community will Stop hate our faction and Stop winning how op seraphon are
 
I just realized a significant advantage of the Oldblood on Carnosaur over the Scar-Vet on Carnosaur. Blood Frenzy.

Both units have the ability, but the Oldblood can activate it sooner than the Scar-Vet, as worded:

If any enemy models are slain by wounds caused by this unit's attacks, for the rest of the battle, this unit is blood-frenzied. Add 1 to wound rolls for attacks made by this unit's mount while it is blood-frenzied.

The slaying wounds that trigger blood frenzy do not need to be melee attacks. The Oldblood can shoot and try to kill a fragile model with his Sunbolt Gauntlet before the Carnosaur enters melee for the first time.
 
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Vallis said:
I just realized of a significant advantage of the Oldblood on Carnosaur over the Scar-Vet on Carnosaur. Blood Frenzy.

Both units have the ability, but the Oldblood can activate it sooner than the Scar-Vet, as worded:

If any enemy models are slain by wounds caused by this unit's attacks, for the rest of the battle, this unit is blood-frenzied. Add 1 to wound rolls for attacks made by this unit's mount while it is blood-frenzied.

The slaying wounds that trigger blood frenzy do not need to be melee attacks. The Oldblood can shoot and try to kill a fragile model with his Sunbolt Gauntlet before the Carnosaur enters melee for the first time.
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Yes, this was also true in our previous book, I believe. He could activate run and charge with kills from his gauntlet. They just so rarely happened. Ha ha.
 
Vallis said:
I just realized of a significant advantage of the Oldblood on Carnosaur over the Scar-Vet on Carnosaur. Blood Frenzy.

Both units have the ability, but the Oldblood can activate it sooner than the Scar-Vet, as worded:

If any enemy models are slain by wounds caused by this unit's attacks, for the rest of the battle, this unit is blood-frenzied. Add 1 to wound rolls for attacks made by this unit's mount while it is blood-frenzied.

The slaying wounds that trigger blood frenzy do not need to be melee attacks. The Oldblood can shoot and try to kill a fragile model with his Sunbolt Gauntlet before the Carnosaur enters melee for the first time.
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Just A Skink said:
Yes, this was also true in our previous book, I believe. He could activate run and charge with kills from his gauntlet. They just so rarely happened. Ha ha.
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I guess this really wouldn't matter for a Koatl's Claw Oldblood on Carnosaur. He'd get +1 to wound already from the charge (including the Oldblood's weapon, which blood frenzy doesn't cover), and so wouldn't need blood frenzy on that first attack anyway.
 
Vallis said:
I guess this really wouldn't matter for a Koatl's Claw Oldblood on Carnosaur. He'd get +1 to wound already from the charge (including the Oldblood's weapon, which blood frenzy doesn't cover), and so wouldn't need blood frenzy on that first attack anyway.
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It's not a question of if they need Blood Frenzy on that first attack, but rather that Blood Frenzy is just flat-out better to already have than the KC subfaction bonus.
 
For those of you worried about how strong our new book is, it looks like seraphon took first and second at one of the first tournaments to allow the book.

https://woehammer.com/2023/06/02/top-three-aos-lists-for-big-bucks-bash-spring-2023/?amp=1

Both lists are pretty similar starborne with Kroak and Slann but no Trog, CPP Engine lists. They both took 10 chameleons which was not something I was expecting but seems good. Skink starpriest over skink starseers. 10 chargers each which seems about right but one was reenforced which doesn't seem right... Terror wings were also picked in one list. Both had cogs but one had a aethervoid pendulum.

Overall it was a very small tournament but still good to see good results seeing as many one here think the new books is trash.
 
Good to hear! I hope we see Coalesced holding its own too!

I think a lot of people don't like the new book because it weakened the attacks of some of our best units and eliminated our craziest buffs. But it also strengthened our weakest troops with rend and slower bracketing, and strengthened our magic game and summoning.

I remember people saying that our army was no longer on the A list and was now B list material. But if Games Workshop is successful at games balance, everything should be knocked off the A list, so that there aren't different strength armies. And every faction and subfaction should have multiple viable builds An impossible task, perhaps, but an effort I support nonetheless.
 
Vallis said:
Good to hear! I hope we see Coalesced holding its own too!

I think a lot of people don't like the new book because it weakened the attacks of some of our best units and eliminated our craziest buffs. But it also strengthened our weakest troops with rend and slower bracketing, and strengthened our magic game and summoning.

I remember people saying that our army was no longer on the A list and was now B list material. But if Games Workshop is successful at games balance, everything should be knocked off the A list, so that there aren't different strength armies. And every faction and subfaction should have multiple viable builds An impossible task, perhaps, but an effort I support nonetheless.
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Here's to hoping!

I think we might start seeing 15-20 chargers in a list once more people have models in hand, or if Kroak gets a points nerf and they have to start cutting big points (I expect the terrawings/pendulum to go first, but we'll see if a slann makes the chopping block)
 
I agree. I think the Raptadon Chargers are going to be abundant in Starborne list, and a favorite target for summons. And a force with three or four units of Chargers may benefit from a unit of Hunters, since the Hunters can split their shooting between units to buff multiple units of Chargers, shoot a second time for a little damage, and optionally charge into melee themselves. They're less likely to be targeted with the Chargers there too.
 
We will be seeing lots of chargers. Both is starborne and coalesced. They are one of our best units being very fast and deadly. I wish they would have buffed rippersdactyls more being chargers seem like just superior rippers.
 
Lambs and Lions said:
For those of you worried about how strong our new book is, it looks like seraphon took first and second at one of the first tournaments to allow the book.

https://woehammer.com/2023/06/02/top-three-aos-lists-for-big-bucks-bash-spring-2023/?amp=1

Both lists are pretty similar starborne with Kroak and Slann but no Trog, CPP Engine lists. They both took 10 chameleons which was not something I was expecting but seems good. Skink starpriest over skink starseers. 10 chargers each which seems about right but one was reenforced which doesn't seem right... Terror wings were also picked in one list. Both had cogs but one had a aethervoid pendulum.

Overall it was a very small tournament but still good to see good results seeing as many one here think the new books is trash.
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I'm honestly not convinced that it has everything to do with the lists brought to the tournament, as much as list-building is the starting point to being able to win your games.

We don't know the board layouts for terrain and deployment of each game they played.

We don't know what scenarios the players had thrown at them.

Since we don't know either of those factors, we also don't know what tactical decisions or dice rolls they made during those games.

Without this additional information, we pretty much don't know if their success at the tournament was at least in part due to their new rules, if not despite them.
 
ChapterAquila92 said:
I'm honestly not convinced that it has everything to do with the lists brought to the tournament, as much as list-building is the starting point to being able to win your games.

We don't know the board layouts for terrain and deployment of each game they played.

We don't know what scenarios the players had thrown at them.

Since we don't know either of those factors, we also don't know what tactical decisions or dice rolls they made during those games.

Without this additional information, we pretty much don't know if their success at the tournament was at least in part due to their new rules, if not despite them.
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A list alone will not win you any games but you can't win unless your list is good.

All we know is that two players got to play in a small tournament that allowed the new book. Both players played a very similar list. The players took 1st and 2nd place.

The list they picked is probably a good list. I expect to see a lot of similar lists showing up. In the next few weeks we will know more as more tournaments allow the book. A lot of people were saying the book is a 3-2, 4-1 book at best. I think the book is pretty good and has play on both sides so let's sit back and see as more results come in.
 
Kilvakar said:
I'd be curious which ones you think are substantially better and which ones are closer to ours in strength. (This is making me miss @Erta Wanderer and @Lizard Wizard's podcasts! I miss the strategies and meta discussions)
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i miss them too. Lizardwizard disappeared off the internet I'm afraid and im not talented or dedicated enough to run the show on my own. that said im always available on discord if you have strategy questions
 
Hey some cool made to order stuff for the Lizardmen on GW. Does this count as The Old World support? :D
 
Lambs and Lions said:
For those of you worried about how strong our new book is, it looks like seraphon took first and second at one of the first tournaments to allow the book.

https://woehammer.com/2023/06/02/top-three-aos-lists-for-big-bucks-bash-spring-2023/?amp=1

Both lists are pretty similar starborne with Kroak and Slann but no Trog, CPP Engine lists. They both took 10 chameleons which was not something I was expecting but seems good. Skink starpriest over skink starseers. 10 chargers each which seems about right but one was reenforced which doesn't seem right... Terror wings were also picked in one list. Both had cogs but one had a aethervoid pendulum.

Overall it was a very small tournament but still good to see good results seeing as many one here think the new books is trash.
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I know every new tome gets "cookie cutter" lists as players test them out, but one of my concerns is that there isn't much else worth taking on the Starborne side by way of Artefact or Command Trait. You might see players toying around with unit choices, but the bones of every Starborne list will virtually always be a Slann general with Lord of Celestial Resonance and a Spacefolder's Stave. The other options are almost so "meh" that even in a casual game you'd ask "why am I taking this?"
 
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