New to the Lizardmen, newish to WHFB

[Caprasauridae]

Hey all!

I started Warhammer last summer with Tomb Kings. It was a hard decision between dead Egyptians and scaly jungle dwellers, but I think what dipped the scale in the favor of Tomb Kings was their new book and awesome units. Now, though, after almost a year and 15 games, I'm planning to get a new army for some change in gaming style.

I have ordered two Battalion boxes and an Oldblood to lead them, and I already have a Slann and one Salamander hunting party. It will be some time before I get to play my first games, as I'm not the quickest painter around but still I weirdly want to play with fully painted minis... One must not be too easy on himself...

I play with a group of friends who have Ogres, Orcs&Goblins, Wood Elves, High Elves and Dark Elves. I'm not thrilled about an idea of tournaments, so those will probably have to do without me.

So, nice to meet you all, my scale-armored friends. Let's have many fruitful discussions on this forum ^^

 

[Arli]

Welcome aboard. We look forward to your input and please let us know if we can help you with anything.

 

[Lord Cedric]

Hello and welcome to Lustria Online! Interesting that you are coming from TKs as I just purchased a TK army a couple weeks ago, though am in need of a couple other models (Scorpions, catapult, and NecroSphinx primarily) , I am almost finished building and ready for undercoating. Do you have any pics or a blog on them on another site so I may get some painting inspiration?

Once again, welcome to the site!

- Lord Cedric

 

[Caprasauridae]

Thank you Arli, that's very friendly of you. I'll probably have some problems when I actually start planning lists and playing games, since I think there are lots of differences when compared to the Tomb Kings.

Lord Cedric, nice to hear that you are into Tomb Kings. They are challenging and very unforgiving, but also really cool and fun army. I love Scorpions, although many bash them since they were nerfed in the new edition. They are a pain to build/keep together, though. And I don't own any Screaming Skull Catapults, but I have heard they are horrendous to put together. What does your current army consist of? Also, I have some pictures in photobucket, although I should add more. I have just been lazy with the camera. You can find the pictures from here: http://s1182.photobucket.com/albums/x459/Capraviridae/

 

[Lord Cedric]

Thank you Arli, that's very friendly of you. I'll probably have some problems when I actually start planning lists and playing games, since I think there are lots of differences when compared to the Tomb Kings.

Lord Cedric, nice to hear that you are into Tomb Kings. They are challenging and very unforgiving, but also really cool and fun army. I love Scorpions, although many bash them since they were nerfed in the new edition. They are a pain to build/keep together, though. And I don't own any Screaming Skull Catapults, but I have heard they are horrendous to put together. What does your current army consist of? Also, I have some pictures in photobucket, although I should add more. I have just been lazy with the camera. You can find the pictures from here: http://s1182.photobucket.com/albums/x459/Capraviridae/

Thank you for sharing your TK Photos! I really like your Warsphinx and NecroKnight serpent wip. The blue on the Sphinx looks great. Is that enchanted blue? Though I know GW/Citadel is changing their paint names and seen the list, but supposedly there will be a cross reference chart in an upcoming White Dwarf.

I like unforgiving armies, actually, and is partially why I wanted TK - and they have some great looking models and the overall army appeal is high on my list of likes. They are my 12th army that I play and have collected.

You asked for my model list so here you go:

Settra on chariot of gods
Khalia
Tomb King on foot
Lich Priest on steed x2
Lich Priest on foot x3
BSB on steed (scratch built by me)
BSB on foot (scratch built by me)
14 Tomb Guard
47 skeleton archers
50 skeleton spears and shields
50 skeleton weapon and shields
14 skeleton cavalry
9 chariots
2 swarms
1 WarSphinx
1 Casket of Souls
3 Ushabti with great weapons
3 NecroKnights
3 Spectral Stalkers

And thats it so far. I am in negotiations on BarterTown for a new NecroSphinx kit, 6 ushabti with bows, and Prince Apophas as well. But I would really like some carrions, scorpions, and a catapult (too bad they are a pain to put together... how is the newer resin kit? any better?)

My next feat is to make a few all-comers lists at 1000 points, 1500, 2000 and 2400. My gaming club likes to play different sized games depending on how much time we have to play, so we all agreed to make different lists.

- Lord Cedric

 

[Caprasauridae]

Oh, I didn't know they are changing the names. Sigh, what a drag...

But thanks for the compliments, I really should post more pictures as the snakes are ready and the sphinx is only missing the riders. If you were asking the colour of the "skin" on the sphinx, that's Hawk Turquoise mixed with varying degrees of Chaos Black. It was my first attempt at shading/highlighting larger areas and I'm quite happy with the results, although they are not perfect. I have high hopes for the Necrosphinx, when I decide to get one... The blue jewels are also Hawk Turquoise. It's one of my favourite colours and can probably be seen on the lizardmen too.

That's a really impressive army! I guess you have lot to learn, if you don't have much experience on fighting against Tomb Kings. But I guess owning 12 armies (!) helps... I'd really like to try out Settra, I have heard wonderful things about him, but I don't have the model and he is quite expensive in points too. Especially since my biggest game has been 2000 points... I do feel that you are on the thin side with the Tomb Guard, though. Usually they are used in a bunch of 20 at the least.

Do you have any pictures of your army? I'm especially curious to see those scratch-build Heralds. And to my knowledge, there are no resin nor plastic models of the Catapult or the Scorpions yet. Only the Casket is in Finecast.

 

[Lord Cedric]

Hawk Turquoise mixed with black. I'll see if I can't get a good blend like yours as I really like that. Well done! I would also like to see more picture if and when you can get a chance. Thank you.

Thanks for the compliment on my army. And you are correct in that I have yet to play against a TK army, but I have played against similar armies but like all things warhammer, no armies are exactly the same. And yep, I have 12 armies and have been collecting them since 5th edtion, while 4th edition is when I was first introduced to the hobby. My other armies that I play are colorized in my signature.

I really agree with the Tomb Guard. The 14 I have were given to me (and most of my army was purchased on BarterTown for only $200 shipped, so I thought it was a good deal) and are the metal ones, so I was wanting more of the same to look alike. I was hoping to boost that number up to 25... at some point. lol.

I can get you pictures of my army! And especially my BSB too. Please take note though that I just got them built, so nothing is undercoated nor painted yet (but I did just pick up some undercoat and the ArmyPainter's QuickShade for dipping which Im eager to try).

Thank you for the help! If you have any suggestions on making up lists at the 1500, 2000, and 2400 levels, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks!

- Lord Cedric

 

[Caprasauridae]

Yeah, I started by painting all the skin with maybe 1:4 mixture of turquoise to black, then with 1:2 mix leaving some dark recesses and then with 1:1 mixture almost the same areas as with the 1:2, because I'm a noob. Then I used pure Hawk Turquoise to highlight and finally washed all the skin with really watered down (at least 1:10, I think) of the 1:1 mixture. I was thinking of doing extreme highlights again with pure turquoise, but then decided not to, as I was afraid it will ruin the model... With the next model I have more confidence in myself, I'm sure. Thank you for your kind words. I'll try to take more pictures as soon as possible and notify you when I'm done.

But... but... but... 200 dollars for all that?! That's extremely great value! I'm jealous... But yeah, I can offer you my opinions on lists, but bear in mind, I'm still rather new and haven't even played with half the units in the army... Usually people include at least the Casket of Souls and Warsphinx and/or Necrosphinx. I have yet to have awesome success with the Casket, but in most of the games it has at least gotten it's points back. But the Warsphinx has rocked the battlefield. The tricky thing is to know which battles to send it. Mine has faired well against small units of elites, but beware enemies with poison and/or ranks. Some people always take two of them and maybe even a Necrosphinx on top. Also, the Sphinxs are really powerful when combo charged with something else, but be careful if you use skeletons with them, as Unstable you lose wounds equal to the combat resolution with ALL your units in the combat. So if your enemies kill skellies like weed in hipster party, your Sphinx will pay the bill.

You got lots of skeletons, so you'll probably want at least experiment with horde style. Including defensively kitted King and maybe a Necrotect for Hatred turns a tarpit unit into an anvil. Heralds can be included too, to give extra protection to the King with their Sworn Bodyguard special rule. Otherwise Heralds are deemed fairly useless, as they are easily killed and Battle Standard is quite expensive to Undead for what it does. Some people have reported some success with Herald carrying The Banner of Undying Legion and joined with Chariots or Ushabti.

Speaking of Chariots... they rock. Always take as many as possible and remember, charge, don't get charged. I have no experience on using Ushabti, so cannot really say anything about them. Usually people call them effective but overpriced. Necropolis Knights have always been really good to me even though I'm really bad at rolling armor saves. In my opinion they give much needed muscle to the army. Sepulchral Stalkers I don't have, but they are great war machine hunters and the only ones with the Entombed Beneath the Sands special rule who can actually do something on the turn they come up. People tend to diss Tomb Swarms and Scorpions, but I really like them. My opponents are often terrified of Scorpions popping up behind them and my Swarms have eaten Teclis with a bunch of elves and send Ogre Ironblaster running and then eaten that too...

Archers are really nice, since you don't have to remember all the rules that give you penalties to hit (a thing that worries me a bit with Lizardmen, as I'm really not accustomed to take note of them) and they work great as a bunker for your Hierophant. I usually wield two mages, one level 3 or 4 as the Hierophant and another level 2 or sometimes 3 on a horse with Lore of Light or Death.

All in all, you have many different ways to play with Tomb Kings and, with an army like yours, many things to try out. Hope you have fun!

 

[Lord Cedric]

Yeah, I started by painting all the skin with maybe 1:4 mixture of turquoise to black, then with 1:2 mix leaving some dark recesses and then with 1:1 mixture almost the same areas as with the 1:2, because I'm a noob. Then I used pure Hawk Turquoise to highlight and finally washed all the skin with really watered down (at least 1:10, I think) of the 1:1 mixture. I was thinking of doing extreme highlights again with pure turquoise, but then decided not to, as I was afraid it will ruin the model... With the next model I have more confidence in myself, I'm sure. Thank you for your kind words. I'll try to take more pictures as soon as possible and notify you when I'm done.

Thank you very much for the ratio formula! I will give this a shot after I get some undercoating done. I may attempt some extreme highlights, but will do a test run first. The Warsphinx will make a really good center piece for the army I think.

But... but... but... 200 dollars for all that?! That's extremely great value! I'm jealous... But yeah, I can offer you my opinions on lists, but bear in mind, I'm still rather new and haven't even played with half the units in the army... Usually people include at least the Casket of Souls and Warsphinx and/or Necrosphinx. I have yet to have awesome success with the Casket, but in most of the games it has at least gotten it's points back. But the Warsphinx has rocked the battlefield. The tricky thing is to know which battles to send it. Mine has faired well against small units of elites, but beware enemies with poison and/or ranks. Some people always take two of them and maybe even a Necrosphinx on top. Also, the Sphinxs are really powerful when combo charged with something else, but be careful if you use skeletons with them, as Unstable you lose wounds equal to the combat resolution with ALL your units in the combat. So if your enemies kill skellies like weed in hipster party, your Sphinx will pay the bill.

Actually, the army was a little cheaper than that as shipping was included, which was about $10. The person I bought it from had everthing built, but some things like the chariots riders and other mounts I didn't like their positioning, so I very carefully did some precision cutting and regluing. Almost all the riders were already glued on, so when I removed them and repositioned them, I did not stick them back on as I prefer getting them painted first and seperately. That took me about a week.

Yeah, the Warsphinx's stats look slick and am eager to test it out. Thank you for the suggestions on its use. I didn't consider the Unstable rule and really glad you brought that up!

You got lots of skeletons, so you'll probably want at least experiment with horde style. Including defensively kitted King and maybe a Necrotect for Hatred turns a tarpit unit into an anvil. Heralds can be included too, to give extra protection to the King with their Sworn Bodyguard special rule. Otherwise Heralds are deemed fairly useless, as they are easily killed and Battle Standard is quite expensive to Undead for what it does. Some people have reported some success with Herald carrying The Banner of Undying Legion and joined with Chariots or Ushabti.

Yes, I was definately planning on doing some hordes. I have looked into just what your suggested here; placing a kitted king and Necrotect in a skele horde. It looks like it should work out well, according to some comments on the Kemri forum. I am a little disheartened about the Herald not being as useful in this army as in others.. though I guess being less needed means more points elsewhere and less dependence on a single model.

Speaking of Chariots... they rock. Always take as many as possible and remember, charge, don't get charged. I have no experience on using Ushabti, so cannot really say anything about them. Usually people call them effective but overpriced. Necropolis Knights have always been really good to me even though I'm really bad at rolling armor saves. In my opinion they give much needed muscle to the army. Sepulchral Stalkers I don't have, but they are great war machine hunters and the only ones with the Entombed Beneath the Sands special rule who can actually do something on the turn they come up. People tend to diss Tomb Swarms and Scorpions, but I really like them. My opponents are often terrified of Scorpions popping up behind them and my Swarms have eaten Teclis with a bunch of elves and send Ogre Ironblaster running and then eaten that too...

Archers are really nice, since you don't have to remember all the rules that give you penalties to hit (a thing that worries me a bit with Lizardmen, as I'm really not accustomed to take note of them) and they work great as a bunker for your Hierophant. I usually wield two mages, one level 3 or 4 as the Hierophant and another level 2 or sometimes 3 on a horse with Lore of Light or Death.

I love playing chariots! In every army that I play, if a chariot is an option, I usually take it. I have really good luck with them.

The Entombed Beneath the Sands, imo, seems very cool and useful as this approach is one that I like to do. Meaning that it fits my playstyle. I was very happy to read that this army has this type of tactic. And your comment on the Scorpions - I couldn't agree more! I have some big plans on using them as I know my opponents and how they play and these units will put into the game a sense of unknowing which will force my club opponents to change up their tactice a bit. Now, the only problem is.. I need some scorpion models! hehe.

I read on the Kemri forum the use of a Hierophant in an archer unit and I think it's something I wish to try. Thank you for giving me more feedback on this as it reinforces my want to give it a try.

All in all, you have many different ways to play with Tomb Kings and, with an army like yours, many things to try out. Hope you have fun!

Thank you very much for the help and great information! Even though you've said that you don't have that much experience in all of the units, it is still much more than what I have! So any offered help will be and is greatly apprecitated!

Ok, now you asked for some pictures. Please keep in mind that they are only put together so have that ugly gray look to most.. but at least you can see and tell what they are! The two boxes in the back of the main army picture will be put into mostly archers. 10 of them will help finish out my 50's in both spears and weapon/shields. So, without further ado... my under constructionTK army:


Here is my custom made Tomb Herald BSB mounted. The shield is an old metal TK shield which helps balance the weight of the banner. I plan on doing some crafty work on the base, but have not applied that to it yet. The circlet with banners around the horses neck was an afterthought - thinking that the Heralds mount is also celebrated. It might look a bit busy, and may up being too busy. But I think if my painting comes out the way I want it too, it should blend in enough without making it look too busy of a model.



The next 2 pics are Older Reaper miniatures that I have had for Dungeons and Dragons. I plan on mounting them on legal bases and doing some neat disign work with them. I think they will make great Tomb King and Lich Priest models!

 

[Arli]

Quick question for you Cedric. Most of the models are GW, do you think you would run into a problem using the reaper models, or would it most likely be ok because your army is mostly GW anyway?

I am just curious. It would make little difference in our club as we hardly ever have a GW related tournament anyway.


Nice army by the way too. What has been the total investment to date (if you do not mind my asking)?

 

[Lord Cedric]

Quick question for you Cedric. Most of the models are GW, do you think you would run into a problem using the reaper models, or would it most likely be ok because your army is mostly GW anyway?

I am just curious. It would make little difference in our club as we hardly ever have a GW related tournament anyway.


Nice army by the way too. What has been the total investment to date (if you do not mind my asking)?

Thank you, Arli! It has taken much work just to get it this far. lol.

To answer your first question, I don't do tournaments because I distain from those who take competiveness to a level of crushing perfection that it ruins the fun factor for me and most lists are not created with a fluff in-mind. While there is nothing wrong with it as they paid for their own armies so they have the right to play how they want to.. it's not for me nor my style. If I can find a laid-back tourney, I would love to participate as I really enjoy fun competition.

With that in-mind and from what I've read, your army must be a certain percentage of GW models. Considering the amount of non-GW I have for this army (only two), and as long as I make the bases GW in style, I really don't think their would be an issue unless the tourney rules strictly forbids them. I could, even, put some GW bits on the model if I wanted making it into "its own", but currently I don't have plans to do that other than basing.

To answer your second question, my current investment (and here I am assuming you mean monetarily), I have a whopping $250 (shipping included) not including paints and QuickShade. I believe I've figured that there is way over 4000 base points in my above picture. I have some VERY good luck with procuring models when I need/want them. Out of my 12 armies to date (none of which is under 2500 in points and my H.Elves are at 10,000 base and Lizardmen and Orcs & Gobbo's are at 6000 points - Goblins alone are at 3000) I am certain I've spent less than $2000 for all of it since I started collecting back in 5th edition. As for a possible total worth of my 12 armies? I really have no idea, but I bet (read Hope!) it's above $2000.

- Lord Cedric

 

[Caprasauridae]

You are most welcome with the hints, glad if I could help. You know, you scratch my back, I scratch yours...

Oh, that army wide shot is magnificent sight! You are really lucky with second-hand shopping, I must admit. Good luck with painting all that, hopefully you are faster than me...

And I think you have done really good job with the Herald on foot, it will look really awe-inspiring when painted, as you'd expect from the Battle Standard. In my opinion the GW herald is a bit too plain, compared to other armies. The standard-turned-necklace-bling is a fun addition, I like it. I'm a bit unsure about the use of Stalker head as a mask. It might work once painted, but if it were me, I'd cut the mask part off and just use the hat/helmet thingie instead. But, as I said, it all depends how you paint it. And those reaper models work really well, especially the King-substitute.

As a side-note, you can find me at the Tomb Kings of Khemri forum (http://z4.invisionfree.com/Khemri/index.php?) with an alias Capraviridae.

 

[Arli]

Thanks Cedric, monetary was what I was wondering about.

 

[Caprasauridae]

Went through the Bartertown, a really nice page, but unfortunately almost everything is from the US. The shipping costs will add quite a lot if you order from there to Europe. Still, I'll keep an eye on that place, maybe I'll get us lucky as you, too.

EDIT: I have now added some more Tomb Kings pictures on my Photobucket account.