Poll: Choose three defenders, the other three will try to kill you

If he'd just used the bloody flamethrower in his vambrace he'd have won that fight. The plot armour was strong with the Skywalker clan.

 

An interesting thought. While there is no reason why they wouldn't, those type of interactions start to detract from the character versus character aspect of this scenario. That, and if we go down that route, then you could simply take Boba's jetpack and fly away once it is safe to do so.

So I'd say that the characters should be limited to their own stock weapons and whatever weapons they might be able to scavenge in the environment.

 

There are no accurate stats to be provided since they are from two separate universes. We are forced to work under the mercy of assumptions. That said, the plasma rifles in Terminator do appear to be full auto (or at the very least boast burst fire) judging by the opening scenes depicted in T2.

As for their relative strengths, tough to tell. The plasma rifles are significantly larger in T2, for what that is worth. But since both universes have different tech and power sources, that only tells us so much. Here is the damage that Boba Fett's carbine does on cloud city.



That looks to be the damage caused by two shots (the third one missing). It's impossible to gauge its destructive power with any significant accuracy since we don't know what the wall is made out of. It's an interior wall in cloud city, which is not a military facility, so it's not designed to be combat resistant. I'd speculate that the T-800 purpose built combat chassis would be more durable. These are the types of assumptions that we each must make and they will influence our choices.

Only he is not more reliable. His programming is glitchy as hell; constantly at war with his human brain. A brain that looks to be suffering from some sort of severe PTSD from being "killed". He spends a significant portion of the movie under repair and/or docked in his charging station. He is the first of his kind, while the T-800 has been refined over time. A proven technology built by a super AI from the future.

The T-800 is far more reliable in every way. Programmed efficiency. Faster. Stronger. Smarter. More durable.

The thing is that Robocop has bad matchups across nearly the entire board. Maybe he can take Dredd, but that's about it.

The T-800 is literally the most resilient tank of the six. Nobody else can take the level of damage that he can. If you want a combatant to soak up damage and keep moving forward, the Arnie terminator is your man machine.

Robocop is the worst bodyguard because he is so extraordinarily slow. Unless you end up in a city where you can commandeer a vehicle, you are stuck at a rate of movement equal to his slow ass walking speed (or are forced to leave him behind). Additionally, anytime he moves he gives away your position because he is so loud. The T-800 is quiet and he can keep up with you (looks to have human speed with the added advantage that he does not tire).


There is of course one more ace I've got hidden up my sleeve, but I'll wait until my writeup.

 

Surely you mean, some OT fans. I have never made such a claim. Personally I think he is incompetent, and despite his arsenal, he does not appear on my team.

You get Dredd as depicted in the Karl Urban movie.

You guys are sleeping on Riddick. When all the other characters are fighting hard in their movies, Riddick is playing with his food. His weapons are clearly the most primitive of the bunch, but it's the man behind the blades that makes him so deadly. Tactically speaking he is the smartest of the group. He outthinks his opponents; always several steps ahead and leaving them unbalanced. It doesn't matter that they have guns and he has knives, they never see him coming. He sets traps and picks apart his opposition piece by piece. On top of that, he is extremely adaptable. He provides your team with counter assassination abilities, battlefield awareness and strategy.

Outside of the predator (who is the clear top choice), he is probably the last guy you want on the other team. You'd be dead before you ever knew he was there. You don't put him on your team primarily for his defensive ability, you put him on your team so that he is not on the opposing team. Also, of all the characters, he has the best chance to take out the Predator. I'm not saying it's a favourable matchup for him, but if Arnie and Danny Glover can do it, you best be sure that Riddick has a chance. And you don't want the star of your team going down.

He is not without flaws, which I will get to in my writeup, but he is a solid pick. Just keep him away from the T-800, which isn't an issue for me.

I never thought I'd see the day you went with Boba. Look at us, you pick the OT character while I pass him over.

 

Beskar mind you is a bit of a newer invention. The armour depicted in ROTJ, while resilient, is not as formidable as depicted in Disney's Mandalorian show. Take a look at the dent/divot in Boba's helmet:



It saved his life, but it did take damage. Formidable, but not invincible.

Also consider that his jetpack malfunctioned due to a relatively light accidental strike from a blind Solo.

 

I'm glad to hear that . Now you mention it I do recall you in the past at some point remarking on how overrated Boba is. My apologies for forgetting.

In any case, my comment there wasn't directed at you specifically, much more directly toward whoever it was that made the image .

Fair enough... haven't seen it though so can't vouch for whether his combat prowess or equipment is any better than what I read about his comic incarnation.

I did say that I've never seen a Riddick film, so I am operating at a knowledge disadvantage here . Again I was operating purely down to what I was able to quickly read about him on wikis and the like, which of course isn't the same... but I am willing to bow to your more seasoned knowledge of the character.

Oh, Beskar has been around in Star Wars lore for far longer than in The Disney Mandalorian... that show simply made the term mainstream. Beskar as a concept dates from the pre-Disney era. Admittedly the concept is still probably newer than Episode VI, but I have Star Wars books from the Lucasfilm era that mention it. Thus do I still treat it as part of Star Wars canon

I know... isn't it tragic? Purely down to having a more in-depth knowledge of his character and knowing that he does have flight as an advantage and a lot of different weaponry... though I fully agree that if we're going by his film performance alone, he is undoubtedly the worst of the lot.

 

Since you didn't specify a particular Boba Fett, I have been operating under Legends skillset (aside from my one joke regarding his using a gafee stick in against stormtroopers). Unlike Deathbattles, I don't merge different time periods/versions into a single composite (looking at Deathbattle's Lara Croft there... I think they did the same to Solid Snake. Just makes for an unfair comparison ¬_¬)

Again, in my T-800 vs Robocop breakdown, I used Deathbattles as a basis. When they aren't making composite versions of characters to skew results, they do (or did last time I watched any of their videos) do a good job of breaking down and doing the maths for their comparisons. And Robocop isn't one I have a vested knowledge of, never even saw the originals at a young enough age to really get into it - I DID watch the old TV series, the one that I later learnt was an alternate timeline to the movies...

But that lack of bias for Robocop could be influencing me to BE biased... I KNOW Terminator, I like Terminator, so I am not discounting the idea that I might be compensating by leaning too far in the opposite direction in an effort to try and avoid letting that bias influence me, which was why I was deferring to Deathbattle as my source for T-800 vs Robocop. Helped by the fact I don't recall them doing a composite Robocop, but maybe I should rewatch to confirm that... Or trust somebody with more innate knowledge to say "well ackshually".

As much as I like to think myself a perfectly logical and impartial being, I am still imperfect and can be biased. And trying to avoid that bias can make be biased in the opposite direction.

He is also the one that gets captured once ever story he's in. Pitch Black started with him having been captured by Johns... JOHNS! Escape from Butcher's Bay, the entire story is that he has been incarcerated and now is working to escape. And he gets foiled multiple times, chucked in higher and higher security blocks, and only escapes because Johns didn't like getting shafted and takes Riddick with him to give him to a different detention facility who will actually pay the bounty (and that bounty might well have increased in value with the damage to Butcher's Bay).

Haven't played it, but pretty sure Assault on Dark Athena only happens because random chance has him awake and able to hide when the ship is grabbed by pirates/scavenger/mercenaries.

Chronicles of Riddick, arrested again, though I vaguely remember that one at least being really short, and had the iconic cup fatality moment.

He plays with his food, but it has gotten him in trouble. Pitch Black, he gets mobbed because he wasn't taking the threat seriously, and it gives them the opening to yank off his goggles and blind him.

Not sleeping on him... but acknowledging his flaws based on the canon depictions that I've seen of him. he's also a massive contrarian... if he is being ordered to kill me, this is the kind of asshole to walk away with a grumble about how nobody tells him what to do.

 

Yup... Boba stinks and the Ewoks stink!

He is the weakest in terms of starting weapons but easily the most skilled and intelligent combatant. Let's just say that if you put his brain in the Predator's body with the Predator's starting kit, that combination would solo the rest of the field.

I know that it has origins in Legends, premiering in sort of iteration in the 90's. Originally called Mandalorian Iron I believe. And it slowly morphed from there on to become the seemingly invincible metal we see in the Disney Mandalorian series.

As far as canon, we'll all differ a bit on where we draw the line. I don't expect everyone to conform to my personal philosophy, but for me it goes something like this:

The 6 mainline Lucas movies > Legends > .... > fan fiction > random fecal scribblings in a gas station stall > Disney Star Wars

Since Boba's armour is clearly damaged in ROTJ (and the pathetic failing of his jetpack), I personally can't attribute Beskar-like qualities to it.

His weaponry is diverse and his ability to fly is a unique advantage within the field of combatants. If someone wants to build a strategy to leverage that, I can't fault them. But for me he is the most incompetent warrior of the group; to a comical level. I simply cannot choose him. With all the fancy tools at his disposal he achieved nothing in ROTJ and got clowned.

 

Watch the movies and you may change your mind. As per the original scenario in the first post of the thread, we're dealing with the 80's movie version of the character

I think I saw that Deathbattle a while ago, and completely disagree with the results (and the analysis they made to reach that conclusion). One character has a widely exposed vulnerable fleshy bit that opens him up to an easy one shot kill while the other does not. The only advantage that Robocop has is that he starts with his pistol. In every other regard the T-800 is better.

I don't know much of his backstory, because that takes placed prior to the events of Pitch Black; his first movie. But in that movie, only 3 people survive and the other two only did so because he saved them.

He is toying with them. If he wanted to kill them immediately he could, very easily.

I haven't played it so I can't say. I tend to shy away from video games as canon though. Their power levels are always all over the place.

You could not be more mistaken. Prior to that point he learns that Jack from Pitch Black (who renames herself Kyra in this film) was stuck in the Crematoria penitentiary and he wants to get her out. So he allows Toombs and his crew to capture him, knowing that Toombs would deliver him to a Triple Max prison, of which there are only three in the system, but only one within range of Toombs' ship... you guessed it Crematoria. So they take him there, and walk him right in through the front door. Exactly where he wanted to be. All the while, he isn't the least bit concerned. He was playing them for fools. They didn't actually capture him, he was just using them as a free and easy shuttle service.

Low quality, but you can watch the exchange here. He knows exactly where they will take him before the crew does.



That's the thing with Riddick, even when everything is seemingly against him and he is in chains with armed captors, he is always the one in control. They're looking at the next move while he sees the checkmate fifteen movies in advance. All the while he is one of the most wanted men in the galaxy. Everybody is gunning for him and he dispatches them one by one. Being captured doesn't mean that much when you can turn the tide at your whim.

Not an issue as per the original scenario rules:

If you choose him for your team, he will stop at nothing to protect you. Likewise, if you don't he will stop a nothing to kill you. All other motivations are irrelevant.

 

I will drop my team selections soon.

 

Going by my previous comments it's probably not hard to deduce my team of three protectors.

1. Predator
2. T-800
3. Riddick

Predator

I'll keep this one short as the predator is the obvious #1 choice. The only character that everyone (at the time of writing) agrees on. He has it all. I'd go as far as to say that if you don't take him, you have very little chance of prevailing.

Reasons to take him:

• the best ranged weapon
• the best close combat weapons
• stealth
• heat vision (and other vision modes too)
• self destruct nuke
• hard counters many of the other combatants
• above average strength and durability (only behind the T-800 and Robocop)

Reasons not to take him:

• is on occasion somewhat prone to making poor decisions, losing to lesser opponents (although most of this is due to his code of the hunt, which does not apply here)
• you have a death wish and secretly want to lose this game

T-800

Easily the most durable character on the list. Essentially a faster, less-glitchy, smarter and more capable version of Robocop and doesn't sport a giant instant loss opening on his face. He is also the only character that Riddick has no ability to kill with his starting base kit (excluding environmental usage and salvaged weapons). He feels no pain and remains dangerous even after sustaining significant damage. Poses an extreme risk to all the other characters with the exception of the Predator who hard counters him with his shoulder cannon.

Reasons to take him:

• the most durable character of the group, the ultimate tank
• physically the strongest character
• huge internal programmed knowledge database
• quick learning
• immune to pain, does not tire, does not sleep
• can self destruct core creating a nuclear explosion
• enhanced machine vision

Reasons not to take him:

• does not start with a ranged weapon, so unless you start off in a populated area he will be reliant on hand-to-hand combat
• his AI is both an advantage and a disadvantage as he lacks human intuition and imagination. He may learn this over time, but probably not before the scenario ends

Riddick

Riddick is the character that I thought people would sleep on, but judging by the poll, I was wrong in that assumption. At first glance, he is the most poorly equipped in terms of offensive and defensive weapons. He has no armour and is typically armed with nothing but a knife. However, look a little deeper and you have the most intelligent and skilled combatant of the six. His battlefield assessment and tactics are far superior to the rest, taking in and making use of information that would go unnoticed by the others. With Riddick it isn't the weapons, it's the warrior. He only has a knife, because he only needs a knife. Where the predator is shown to be consistently defeated by weaker and more poorly equipped foes, Riddick is the one always beating the odds. He is adaptive and can leverage the environment better than anyone else. And then you have his enhanced night vision allowing him to see most others before they see him.

Most importantly, the number one reason to take Riddick isn't so that he is on your team, it is so that he isn't on the other team. He is the ultimate assassin of the group. He isn't going to fight the other characters (although he has the capability, T-800 being the exception depending on terrain), he is going to take you out.

Reasons to take him:

• highest intelligence and tactical awareness of the six
• extremely stealthy
• the best in terms of actual fighting skills and agility
• of all the characters he has the greatest chance of taking out the predator
• impressive adaptability, improvisation and a track record of overcoming the odds
• you don't want the best assassin to be on the other team!

Reasons not to take him:

• no ranged weapons and no armour

Reasons not to take the others (I'll keep this short since we're largely retreading the same ground covered in previous posts).

Boba has an impressive arsenal, and his flight is a unique advantage, but he is the shittiest warrior of the group. He is essentially the opposite of Riddick. If a blind and disorientated took him out, then any of my defenders can too. He may have a lot of hype around him, but what he actually showed us in ROTJ is extremely subpar. Every other combatant was show to be more capable.

Robocop is too much of a liability with his extraordinarily slow walking speed, poor agility and noisy movement. Other than starting with his auto pistol, which is nice, he is an inferior version of the T-800. On top of all that, he is shown to be extraordinarily glitchy and high maintenance. So if you want a tank, just take a better tank... the T-800.

While Dredd doesn't have an inherent weaknesses, he doesn't particularly excel when compared to the others. His pistol is extremely versatile, which is his top selling point, but at the end of the day he is just a man with a fancy handgun. While he is very well trained for urban combat, he is much less experienced/useful elsewhere, and with randomized drop points, there are more places in the world that are "not cities" than cities. Predator outguns him, the T-800 walks through him and Riddick kills him before he even knew he was there.



With my chosen team, here are the best and worst case scenarios:

Best case scenario #1: Nighttime in a city. My T-800 can now scavenge weapons, making him extraordinarily dangerous (god forbid we land in Texas ). Riddick becomes god tier with all the cover and terrain that can be leveraged and you don't want to be facing him during the night. Boba Fett's flight advantage is largely neutralized. The opposing Judge Dredd does get a boost do to his experience with urban warfare, but nowhere near to the level of my defenders. Riddick can kill anyone of them. Predator can kill anyone of them. Arnie can kill any one of them.

Best case scenario #2: Nighttime in a thick jungle/forest. Boba Fett's flight is even more useless. Predator and Riddick can easily take out the opposition. Poor Robocop can barely move in the city with level concrete/asphalt, now imagine him on uneven difficult terrain. Sure my T-800 has no ranged weapons, but we don't need it.


Worst case scenario: Daytime, in a flat open field in the middle of nowhere with no cover and it's raining. It's one thing to consider a good drop, but it is probably more important to strategize for when shit hits the fan. While this is a rare case, since most places on earth have some sort of cover, let's explore how we survive it. Predator's cloak fails. Riddick can't sneak up on anyone and is largely neutralized. Two of my defenders have no ranged weapons, while all three of the opposition does. No darkness for my team to leverage. Counter strategy... The number one threat becomes Boba Fett despite his incompetence. Boba is the faster than anybody on the battlefield with his flight and can easily find you. If I didn't have Predator this would be an auto-loss for me. Predator's sole responsibility becomes grounding and eliminating Boba. He must stay close to me, otherwise I can easily be caught out. Luckily, Predator's range and accuracy are far better than Boba's. Hence, if Boba flies in range, Boba falls. Importantly, while Boba is the fastest of the six, the rest of his team is not. Dredd is probably slightly slower than I am, since he is armoured and carrying more equipment, while Robocop is significantly slower (he really hurts the team in this regard). As such, Boba has to choose to separate from his team (and get picked off by the Predator) or he is confined to his teammate's speed. Therefore, my team moves away from them, knowing that they can't catch us. We look for more advantageous terrain and hope they are stupid enough to split off from one another. Once we find useful terrain, we win. If Boba falls, we win. If nighttime arrives, Riddick is back in the game and we win. Predator can kill any of the opposing three, while the T-800 can easily solo anyone other than a flying Boba. Riddick becomes the battlefield general, dictating our course of action and travel. We still have more win conditions (eliminate Boba, find better terrain, last until nighttime) and only have to prevent Boba from getting into range, which Predator can do. Remember, Boba isn't exactly stealthy flying through the air and we have better sensory detection than they do (better aim too). So it's a much closer match, and we can lose, but odds are still on our side. Our team is smarter. Our team is faster. They may have more ranged weapons, but we have more long ranged weapons. Dredd and Robcop have pistols (which are short range weapons) and Boba Fett can't hit shit. Predator's shoulder cannon sees us through the day. Better accuracy, better range and greater stopping power. There is a zone/distance where they have the range advantage (pistol range), but we can prevent them from ever achieving that range.