8th Ed. Possible New LM Player, needs some help!

[Galacticz]

Hey guys, I am new to WHFB, and I am having a massively hard time figuring out which army i want to play. I am starting to seriously look into LM because they seem to have everything I am looking for. I just need to know some things about them!

First of all, Its very important that I am able to develop a backstory for my army and the characters. Do lizardmen have enough fluff and character to do this? Could someone give me a basic run down of their fluff? I also hear that LM from different temple cities worship different gods and are quite different; could anyone give me a run down of the different cities as well?

How do they play on the board? They seem very versatile, and they seem to dominate both magic and CC, and thats is what i am looking for in an army. Is this observation true? Are there many viable lists to play or just a few 'cookie-cutter' lists that we all have to conform to?

I really want to just pick an army I like and get on with my hobby, help talk me into Lizardmen!!

Thanks in advance guys!

 

[Agrem]

Hello,

Lizarmend are really fun army to play with and I can really recommend them. I am not that much into all the fluff and background thing so I'll leave the commentary of them to someone else.

In the battlefield/tabletop Lizardmen can perform really well in all the phases. We have quick and flexible units of skinks and terradons which can restrict your opponents movement and give them hard choices of what to do.

In magic phase the Slann can dominate alone without any support from the skink priests. Fully equipped slann is quite the beast. Also heavens lore for skink priests can be effective if you don't run slann in your army. Usually though it is the combat oriented army. For me the Slann usually works more as support more than offensive.

Opponents can't really underestimate the shooting phase of the lizardmen. We don't have that much long range weapons but the poison darts in close range can be very effective. Also couple of salamanders are brutal. They can be even more effective than other rock lobbers and such. Atleast harder to kill.

Close combat is also quite good for lizardmen. Saurus can work well without any support and if you need more punch the kroxigors or temple guard add a bit more strength. Every saurus unit should find it's way to close combat as soon as possible I think (ofcourse this is very situational). Backed up with light magic the skink+kroxigor units can really do some harm to enemies. The number of skinks that actually die in cc with light magic is quite low if played right.

Almost all of our army book entries are playable. I think only jungle swarms are the no-go option. Razordons are a bit in the weak side but that's mainly because they are competing with their salamander cousins. The number of stegadons are also reducing now because all the cannons and template weapons have become more common but I think they have their place too.

Hopefully this helps you when choosing lizardmen.

BR
Agrem

 

[Battlehamster]

I'll handle the fluff bit since Agrem handled the "how they play" aspect already.

Lizardmen used to be the servants of a mysterious race of beings called the "Old Ones". These Old Ones found the world of Warhammer and decided to shape it to their purposes. The LM were their most trusted servants with the Slann serving as personal attendants and helpers for the heavy magic and technology the Old Ones employed.

However one day the warp gates that the Old Ones installed at the poles of the world became corrupted and let into the world the forces of Chaos. Daemons and their ilk scoured the land, hoping to extinguish all life. The mortal races of the world fought against these daemons, the Old Ones foremost along with their fathful LM servants. However the Old Ones were eventually driven out and possibly destroyed one by one until only the mortal races were left. Without their former masters to guide them, the Slann took it upon themselves to save the world through a series of mighty magics coupled with the high elves to finally throw the daemons out of the world and contain them within their own realm; at a cost.

The Slann are now the masters of the LM, meditating on the master plan left by the Old Ones. They seek to continue the work of their masters, following the great plan and putting the world back on track with the Old Ones' vision. The mighty saurus form the battle lines of the LM, driving back invaders of the the Lustrian jungles and defilers of the ancient temple cities. The skinks attend the Slann and perform the more complicated jobs of the realm, from crafts to deciphering the cryptic messages of their Slann masters.

All this can be found in various fluff books from the regular ol' LM Army Book to other Warhammer novels and timelines. The LM have a Mayan/Aztec theme to them as they have reverted to a more primitive technology with the fall of their technologically superior masters. Even though Slann are the most powerful spell casters in the world, they are considered dullards when compared to their first spawning kin who died out and the godlike Old Ones who used to employ them.

Hope that helped.

 

[Lord Cedric]

I can elaborate on the cities and the gods.

There are but few standing cities left in Lustria. Hexoatl, Tlaxtlan, Xlanhuapec and Itza. The cities of Pahuax, Tlanxla, Xahutec, Tlax, Chaqua, Huatl, Quetza, Axlotl, Oyxl and Chupayotl (which is now submerged) are all ruined by different wars.

Each of the Temple-Cities is positioned to relate to specific constellations and space-alignments. This, along with criscrossing the Lines of Power help form a very powerful magical "web" that the Slann use to help enhance thier powers and as a form of magical communication.

Also, each of the Temple-Cities is built and named after a different founding Old-One god.

Since there are no female lizards, the army is built from specific yet different spawning pools located around the old and new world. Tzunki (water), Sotek (serpent), Quetzl (warrior), Tlazcotl (impassivenss), Chotec (sun), Huanchi (jaguar - jungle movement), Tepok (air), Itzl (Cold-One Riding). There is also a VERY special sacred spawning - the rarest - who are "Marked By The Old Ones" and are usually white or albino in color. They are usually spawned in times of great need.

- Lord Cedric

 

[Galacticz]

Wow! Thanks for the replies! What do you folks think i need to start playing small games of WHFB with LM? can a slann be used in games under 1500 points effectively?

 

[Agrem]

Remember that you can only spend 25% points of the total army to your slann. On 1500 point game this would mean 375 points which in my opinion would be more than enough. I'd say two disciplines, bsb and some nice magic item would do the trick.

Actually with such low point game slann becomes even more powerfull choice than it would normally be. Just remember that your opponents might be a bit annoyed by him in small games.

BR
Agrem

 

[MI_Tiger]

Remember that you can only spend 25% points of the total army to your slann. On 1500 point game this would mean 375 points which in my opinion would be more than enough. I'd say two disciplines, bsb and some nice magic item would do the trick.

That would definitely do the trick, but unfortunately you can't get close to that for 375 points. More realistically, you could probably field a Slann with max 1 Discipline plus Cupped Hands or something similar. To be the BSB, you would have to give up the Discipline or Magic Item, or you could bring along a Scar Vet to carry the banner.

In my opinion, 1500 is pushing the limit for having a cost effective Slann. What makes the Slann the best caster in the game is the ability to take a couple of key Disciplines. It is also a major advantage to bring along the protection of Temple Guard (which you may not be able to afford at 1500), especially if the Slann is the BSB. Unfortunately, although he is worth his points, a truly effective Slann build (including TG) is expensive. If you field him "naked" without Disciplines or TG, the Slann is "just" a Level 4 caster, and a costly one at that. For him to really shine, you need the points to outfit him well, including either TG for protection or disciplines/magic items for a solo Slann.

But don't let this put you off on buying a Slann. He is still a L4 wizard and can be used well at 1500 or slightly lower even though you won't get the most from him. More importantly, if you are planning to build a larger army, you will definitely want a frog.

 

[Agrem]

Remember that you can only spend 25% points of the total army to your slann. On 1500 point game this would mean 375 points which in my opinion would be more than enough. I'd say two disciplines, bsb and some nice magic item would do the trick.

That would definitely do the trick, but unfortunately you can't get close to that for 375 points. More realistically, you could probably field a Slann with max 1 Discipline plus Cupped Hands or something similar. To be the BSB, you would have to give up the Discipline or Magic Item, or you could bring along a Scar Vet to carry the banner.

I disagree. Because the first discipline being free you can in my opinion get quite decent slann here. For example cogitation and +1pd or soul of stone for miscast protection. In addition to those three only the loremaster and higher state are the ones mainly used. Obviously you can't get all of them but take the plaque of tepok instead of loremaster and then TG for protection. With tepok you have decent chance of rollind doubles in spell generation and this will almost guarantee you the spells you want. For game of this size I would take cogitation and soul of stone just to make it a bit more "friendly" and the miscast protection is always nice.

So Slann+two disciplines+tepok+bsb goes under the 375 point limit and still is quite good. Fully kitted elf mage would cost around the same.

TG will be quite expensive unit which in a way adds more cost to our slann but then again you have purchased another combat unit. Also 5 wounds and 4+ ward isn't actually that bad unless you're facing gunline.

BR
Agrem

 

[MI_Tiger]

You're right. I completely forgot about the first Discipline being free.

I still think 1500 is the low end for running an effective Slann, but he could still be a difference-maker at that point level.

 

[Coatl]

thats an easy one

Slann: Loremaster, +1 PD, BSB, Dispel

20 Saurus: Command
20 Saurus: Command

20 Temple Guard: Command
10 Chameleons

2 Salamanders

1500 pts on the dot