8th Ed. Question about miscasts and their effects

[Haemoglobin]

If a unit of White Lions carrying that banner that gives them the 2+ ward to magic and magic weapons etc, do they also gain that wardsave against the effects of a miscast? For instance the str 10 template?

 

[Arli]

No, they do not. Someone else will have to site a source, I am not sure where that is.

 

[Stonecutter]

Although it may seem quite silly, the BoWD does indeed protect a HE wizard and their unit from most of the miscast results that inflict damage. As per the FAQ special rule for magical attacks:

Q: What are ‘magical attacks’? (p68)
A: All attacks made by spells and magic items are considered to be magical attacks, as are all attacks that are specifically noted as being magical attacks. Shots fired from magical items are also considered to be magical attacks, unless their description specifically states otherwise. Hits inflicted by rolls on the Miscast table are treated as magical attacks.

Since the BoWD wording for the 2+ ward also includes wounds caused by "magical attacks", the end result is that HE wizards can be quite bold. All of the other effects (drain power dice, levels, etc) still occur and a dimensional cascade followed by a 3 or less on the die roll still removes the wizard from the game without any save even if they were not wounded by the initial template explosion.

 

[Haemoglobin]

Yeah, a horde of 40 White Lions is now neigh unkillable sadly.

 

[rychek]

Unless you have artillery (though that doesn't help us at all). Terradons dropping rocks should be effective.

 

[Haemoglobin]

They get a 3+ armoursave against shooting. So Lizardmen are kinda screwed if you aren't running with dwellers. Which we cant reliably have anymore. Can't really break them in combat because they are stubborn/steadfast and they tend to rack up combat res with the potential of 41 ASF, S6, WS5? attacks with rerolls. I have no clue how to get rid of them except for a dwellers or just throwing all the chaff I have at them.
Or if we manage to cast the spell that wounds and destroys the banner. I'll probably take my slann out of my TG and 6dice to get rid of it.

GW really did think that banner through...

 

[rychek]

White Lions do not get re-rolls in their new book (unless I missed a very recent FAQ). Nor do Sword Masters or any other great weapon weilding HE units. They still hit in initiative order, so they will strike first, but they no longer have the Speed of Asuryan rule which allowed ASF to completely overrule ASL from the great weapon.

 

[Rhodium]

They get a 3+ armoursave against shooting. So Lizardmen are kinda screwed if you aren't running with dwellers. Which we cant reliably have anymore. Can't really break them in combat because they are stubborn/steadfast and they tend to rack up combat res with the potential of 41 ASF, S6, WS5? attacks with rerolls. I have no clue how to get rid of them except for a dwellers or just throwing all the chaff I have at them.
Or if we manage to cast the spell that wounds and destroys the banner. I'll probably take my slann out of my TG and 6dice to get rid of it.

GW really did think that banner through...

Not just dwellers

Purple sun and pit will remove 1/6 of them

final trans will get rid of 1/3 of them

Not ideal but will whittle them down

 

[Haemoglobin]

White Lions do not get re-rolls in their new book (unless I missed a very recent FAQ). Nor do Sword Masters or any other great weapon weilding HE units. They still hit in initiative order, so they will strike first, but they no longer have the Speed of Asuryan rule which allowed ASF to completely overrule ASL from the great weapon.

I'm definately gonna have to tell my friend about that xD, he is used to rerolling his to hit rolls that he just always does it. Except for mounts.

 

[rychek]

Yep. Sword Masters are nearly useless now (compared to White Lions and Phoenix Guard) thanks to that change. It makes me sad because I have a nice unit of painted SMs that I don't use.

 

[Hebus]

Although it may seem quite silly, the BoWD does indeed protect a HE wizard and their unit from most of the miscast results that inflict damage. As per the FAQ special rule for magical attacks:

Q: What are ‘magical attacks’? (p68)
A: All attacks made by spells and magic items are considered to be magical attacks, as are all attacks that are specifically noted as being magical attacks. Shots fired from magical items are also considered to be magical attacks, unless their description specifically states otherwise. Hits inflicted by rolls on the Miscast table are treated as magical attacks.

I'm quite sure about the answer, but does this mean that you have MR against Miscast hits ?? Meaning a Slann with MR2 has a 2++ against miscast rolls ?


Of course, my guess is no.

 

[rychek]

No, magic resistance only applies to "spell damage", not to magic attacks in general.

Per the rule book FAQ:

Q: Is damage caused by a miscast counted as a spell? Can a model with Magic Resistance add it to its ward save against it? (p34)
A: No to both questions.

 

[Hebus]

Thanks

When does this part : "Hits inflicted by rolls on the Miscast table are treated as magical attacks." applies then ?

 

[rychek]

All spells are magic attacks/damage, but not all magic attacks/damage are from spells. Magic Resistance is only usable against spells. Any magic attacks caused by means other than a spell are not affected my magic resistance.

Hits from miscasts are applied when a wizard rolls double 6s and subsequently miscasts. Some of the miscast table results include the wizard or nearby wizards or models in base to base contact taking some number of hits. These hits are considered magic attacks and thus are influenced by the Banner of the World Dragon, but not my Magic Resistance.

Edit: clarification

 

[MI_Tiger]

The magical attacks designation can matter in a few cases. For example, miscast damage can effect ethereal models. And Wood Elf forest spirits would not get their ward save against them. There are several other cases like this.