8th Ed. Recommend Lizards against Ogres, Dwarfs, Wood Elves,TK?

[Heisenborg]

Hi, sorry for the essay that follows: My main opponent is an Ogre Kingdoms player that likes to run tournament inspired lists, and stays away from big monsters like the Stonehorn. The rest of my local meta game features players using Tomb Kings, Wood Elves, Dwarfs, and soon my own Orcs and Goblins. I started Fantasy in the summer and I plan on giving my little brother my Orcs and Goblins army.

While I loved (and hated) the greenskins, especially in the variety of units they have to offer (but not when it comes to animosity checks and spell lores), I am ready to move on and paint another army. I really like the carnosaur model and the rest of the scaley bunch found in the Lizardmen, and I was wondering if you guys would recommend this army for these match-ups? Would both sides have a good time or is that too llist dependent to say? For example, like the game of 'rock paper scissors' goes, the Wood Elves can feel like the 'paper' to the Ogre Kingdom's 'rock' since WE have excellent str4 shooting and dwellers to wreck havoc on the man boob army.

I would like to avoid those kind of matchups and have read that Lizards and Ogres can present some serious challenges for eachother, and a common argument is that the Lizards simply can't do enough damage vs the Ogres?

Thanks for reading this, take care, and may the dice gods be with ya'll

 

[n810]

Well sinces those are three completely different types of armys,
you should probay take the typical Slann/templeguard/saurus/salamander/skinks army.
that like most of the Lizardmen army list consist of.

Ps. you probaly going to loose alot against the Ogres and Dwarves.

 

[Arli]

With Ogres and Dwarves, their primary weakness will be low Iniative. You can take advantage of that by using death magic, Light magic (ASF, Speed of Light), Shadow (Lower T), as well as many others. The biggest thing to watch for in either army is the shooting.

Dwarves can bring enough shooting (Magic Cannonballs) to devastate an army. Couple that with the Anti-Magic that they have and it can be a real challenge to face them.

Ogres, on the other hand do not have a lot of shooting, but what they have is very powerful. Ogres have the best cannon in the game. As long as it does not misfire (on initial roll), it will almost always hit its target. They also have the Death Fist SM(Greedy Fist on a Death Slaughtermaster). You do not want that thing within 24 inches of your slann. The HellHeart is another thing that can be devastating, but it can be lessened with the use of cupped hands.

When/If I face either army, I would make sure that I have as many chameleons and salamanders as I could take. I would not take Terradons against Dwarves though (they can ground that unit with the anvil). The primary targets would be war machines.

Once you deal with those, you have some room to move on how you deal with the rest. Skinks shooting poison javelins/blowpipes will even the playing field quite a bit.

Against Ogres, do not let them charge you! That in itself will negate impact hits that you will get.

 

[Taipan]

They're different armies, but you can fit in all the right tools. I'm assuming you play at 3k. If not, just scale this appropriately;

Shadow Slann, Cupped Hands, Rumination, Mystery
Light Slann, BSB and General, Rumination, Plaque of Tepok, Banner of Eternal Flame

Level 1 Skink Priest w/Blood Statuette, EOTG
Scar-Veteran w/Burning Blade, light armour, shield, Dragonbane Gem, Potion of Strength
Scar-Veteran w/Piranha Blade, light armour, Enchanted Shield, Potion of Speed

(2) Standard Bearer, Musician, 18 x Saurus w/hand weapon+shield
(4) 10 x Skinks w/blowpipes

Standard Bearer, Musician, 18 x Temple Guard
Musician, 19 x Temple Guard

(3) Salamander


Ogres:

They're a tough army to take on, no two ways about it. If they have the Rune Maw on the Gutstar, you are up the proverbial creek, as 'Pit of Shades' gets blocked (although it can scatter onto them if targeted at another unit nearby). Go wide against him (Gutstar is 6 across, 3 deep), use 'Mindrazor' and 'Speed of Light'/'Bironas Timewarp' to punish him. Feed him the Saurus first, then commit with both Temple Guard units once he's chewed through them. Skinks are going to block any Mournfang shenanigans, and Salamanders can cause a few wounds...maybe. It's a hard matchup, you really need artillery, which we simply don't have.

Don't forget to challenge out the Deathfist Slaughtermaster with the Piranha Scar-Vet, use the Burning Scar-Vet to murder the Butcher (denies the Regen spell, has fewer wounds so you are more likely to get the kill after drinking the strength potion). Challenging out the Bruiser carrying the Rune Maw is next to impossible. Between the unit champion, Butcher and Slaughtermaster, he has too many characters who can accept instead.


Dwarves:

Close the distance. Dwarves are deathly slow and their real strength is warmachines and shooting. Put up 'Phas Protection' and the Gungan shield from the EOTG, get into combat ASAP. Before you get there, dump flames onto them with the Salamanders, melt their buffers of great weapon Warriors down to size. They're going to deny a lot of magic, so cast lots of buffs and debuffs to burn through their dispel pool and runes. If you actually manage to get either 'Mindrazor' or 'Pit' past them, they are screwed. Also, if the EOTG is still alive when you reach enemy lines, 'Burning Alignment' makes them weep with rage. The Scar-Vets are pretty good at deleting Runesmiths from units, and the Piranha Scar-Vet can probably take down a

Wood Elves:

Pretty similar strategy to above. Salamanders are the rape train with no brakes in this matchup. WE blocks die horribly to them, Treekin and Dryads get turned to ash...its really just the fast flanking stuff (Warhawk Riders, Wild Riders, Eagles) and Treemen that will give you problems. Their magic is pretty weaksauce compared to yours. Expect plenty of Saurus to get shot up by S4 bowfire, but once you hit melee their blocks just evaporate (terrible armour, T3, usual Elf story).

Tomb Kings:

An interesting matchup. Their magic is pretty good, they can grind Saurus to death with cheap Skeleton spam, and they have some fast monsters/monstrous cavalry that can flank us. Their terrible Initiative means 'Pit' is going to do a number of most of their units (in particular the big monsters like Necrosphinx or Warsphinx). The Scar-Vets are going to ace most challenges, although you'll lose them to 'Curse' if you assassinate a King or Prince. It'll be pretty amusing to send the Burning Scar-Vet against Settra.

 

[Heisenborg]

Thanks for the replies! It turns out my main opponent will be the Ogre Kingdoms player and we'll play 2400-2500 points, along with 1500 pts double games. He likes to run the Greedfist build and will probably have two ironblasters or some gorgers, and as many leadbelchers he can field along with two sabertusks. He also has no problem with tailoring competitive lists and vice versa.