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8th Ed. skink chiefies

Man0waR said:
Why are we arguing this?

Dragonhelm states that you can combine it with other kind of armour like mundane shield and light/heavy armour. Same as the two other helms in BRB.

If I am not wrong, Lizardmen Sacred Stegadon Helm, says the same.

As for other armies like WoC you have another example.
Click to expand...

Dragon helm states no such thing. Sacred Steg helmet does not say the same either.
 
Well it not state with those words.

Spanish rulebook says:

"el portador mejora su tirada de salvación por armadura en un punto"

Transaltion:
The bearer improves his armour save by 1.

And the rule when magic items override the common items are this.

"Una miniatura sólo puede llevar una armadura y un escudo, Por tanto, si adquiere una armadura o escudo mágico sustituirá a cualquier equivalente mundano que llevase la miniatura."

Translation:
A model can only wear one armour and one shield. So if it aquires a magic armour or shield it will override the mundane suit the model was wearing.

As all the helms dont state they are shield neither light or heavy armour, it wont override any mundane options of the model. Also it improve it by 1 and further effects it gives.

So please check all the shield and armours in the BRB they are clearly stated which kind of type base item are they made.

Armour of destiny / Fortune / Gambler's / 2+ AS save : Heavy armour.
Glittering Scales: Light armour.
All shields are shields.
Other options in BRB magic armour list will not override any of the mundane options.


Now with rulebook in hand.
 
the above is correct.

also:

Scar Vet
Cold one
Light armour
dragonhelm
Great weapon.

was a regular build during last years warhammer leagues and probably still is.

Its fully legal.

Now.. back to subject shall we?

Cheiftans
Now
Viable
(Pony!!!)
(WHAT?)
(I DONT KNOW!!!)
 
Man0waR said:
Well it not state with those words.

Spanish rulebook says:

"el portador mejora su tirada de salvación por armadura en un punto"

Transaltion:
The bearer improves his armour save by 1.

And the rule when magic items override the common items are this.

"Una miniatura sólo puede llevar una armadura y un escudo, Por tanto, si adquiere una armadura o escudo mágico sustituirá a cualquier equivalente mundano que llevase la miniatura."

Translation:
A model can only wear one armour and one shield. So if it aquires a magic armour or shield it will override the mundane suit the model was wearing.

As all the helms dont state they are shield neither light or heavy armour, it wont override any mundane options of the model. Also it improve it by 1 and further effects it gives.

So please check all the shield and armours in the BRB they are clearly stated which kind of type base item are they made.

Armour of destiny / Fortune / Gambler's / 2+ AS save : Heavy armour.
Glittering Scales: Light armour.
All shields are shields.
Other options in BRB magic armour list will not override any of the mundane options.


Now with rulebook in hand.
Click to expand...

indeed. a model can wear Only One armour. so light armour (armour) and steg helm (which is a magic armour) cannot be taken together. end of story. Also dragonhelm is an armour and cannot be taken with light armour. or they can, but the magic armour thusly overrides the light armour so theres no sense in taking the light armour.
 
Phatmotha-phucka said:
the above is correct.

also:

Scar Vet
Cold one
Light armour
dragonhelm
Great weapon.

was a regular build during last years warhammer leagues and probably still is.

Its fully legal.

Now.. back to subject shall we?
Click to expand...

I have no idea why it is legal. Maybe some 7th ed rulings?
 
It is legal, because, helms are not armor, like it is written for magical "armors" (armor of destiny : heavy armor, first line for exemple).
 
Hebus said:
It is legal, because, helms are not armor, like it is written for magical "armors" (armor of destiny : heavy armor, first line for exemple).
Click to expand...

Ofcourse they are armor. Dragonhelm is under the topic Magic Armour. and Steg helm is defined as a Magic Armour.
With certain items, they just seem to be more specific.
Now for example Talisman Of Preservation is not an armor.
 
rantapanda said:
Hebus said:
It is legal, because, helms are not armor, like it is written for magical "armors" (armor of destiny : heavy armor, first line for exemple).
Click to expand...

Ofcourse they are armor. Dragonhelm is under the topic Magic Armour. and Steg helm is defined as a Magic Armour.
With certain items, they just seem to be more specific.
Now for example Talisman Of Preservation is not an armor.
Click to expand...

They aren't classified as neither light armour nor heavy armour. Look in the BRB, all the H/L armours are classified as such, shields as shields.

Helmets aren't really classified, they just give extra armour. If anything they should've been classified as helmets.

Nowhere does it say that the helmet is light or heavy armour (or a suit of armour) - which you are basically argueing they are. So since they aren't classified why exactly are you assuming they take a spot from one of the armour sets? Are you going to say that a simple helmet is supposed to be a "suit of armour" and thus replaces it?

If anything this just needs a minor errata stating that helmets are a category by themself and thus won't replac a suit of armour.

Suits of armour, shields and helmets are IMO 3 different equipments. You can take a shield and a heavy armour, why shouldn't you be able to take a shield, heavy armour and a magical helmet? It's not exactly like we're stacking light armour on top of heavy armour or vice versa.
 
FAQ would indeed be the best thing, as there doesnt seem to be a clear way how to do this.
I understand ur point. But it seems it comes down to the definition of a suit and what a light armour of heavy armour consists of.
It does make sense in a way that u could have a breast plate and a helmet. However it doesnt make sense to have a heavy or chaos armour and then put a helmet on it. As heavy armour already comes with a helm. A helmet on top of a helmet? A light armour or Heavy armour is more than a breastplate. Infact most regular light armours come with helms as well.

but as u said the helms probably cant be classified as suits and thus should not replace stuff. and thus l.armour and helms should be able to be used together.

but that wasnt the main point.

Previously ManOwar stated that a model can only have one piece of armour. all light/heavy armours and helms are armours, theres no refuting that. but..
I cant find any location in the rulebook which actually says that a model can only have one armour. I believe previous armybook stated it like so but not anymore?, so seems you indeed can take more than 1 armour. Where exactly did u find it ManOwar?

Now i dont have any problems using a dragonhelm and light armour together but to me it doesnt make sense.
and it seems like u indeed can take a helm with armour. Also seems like spaniards cant take helm and armour together but people playing by the english rules, can :D ?
 
You are forgetting something. It's not *just* as helmet on top of a helmet. It's a magical helmet that replaces the current mundane one (IF there should be one - the book doesn't actually mention this?).

I realize that it gets sort of silly saying that you can now change certain parts of a full suit of armour though, but as you said so yourself this is something a FAQ would have to adress.
 
rantapanda said:
I understand ur point. But it seems it comes down to the definition of a suit and what a light armour of heavy armour consists of.
Click to expand...

they mention 2 types in the rules

"Suit of armour" and "shields"

then if you look to the items you will see only two "types" are shown.
"Shield" and "# Armour" (where # is heavy or light)
No other item types is shown in the list.

so I think its fairly simple and safe to assume (where "assume" is a stand-in for "Dead certain") that

Suit of armour...as in armour suit...: Light armour, heavy armour..magical or not
Shield: ..shield...magical or not.
anything else is just armour...magical or not, and nowhere does it say that you can only ever wear a single piece of armour in total.

to you who thinks suit of armour comes with a helmet and are thus the same: why are the helmets the only thing in the Magic Armour section that isnt defined by type of heavy or light?
Why put in the "count your armoursave 1 higher" instead of just classifying it as "light armour" ?
Because: THAT would make it illegal for the pieces to be put together.


if youve been playing otherwise you have been playing wrong all this time, and you should be grateful to find out as your opponents dead certain have had an upperhand in the armour-race till now.
 
The critical thing here is that all magical suits of armour are clearly labeled light armour or heavy armour. All shields are labeled shields.

Helms aren't so it makes as much sense to say they take up a shield slot as to say they take up an armour suit slot. Basically, they just take up your magic armour slot, take mundane armour and shield with them.

Back to the topic at hand, an interesting thing to note with skink chiefs is that mounting them onto a terradon/ripperdacyle or stegadon makes them immune to killing blow (turns teh entire model into a MC or monster type).


Annoyingly a chief on a terrdaon/ripperdaclye also can't join other flying units (nor can a character on amount join a unit of skirmishers?), and because he's on his own he doesn't get the skirmisher rule, so no -1 to hit him with shooting.
 
Phatmotha-phucka said:
if youve been playing otherwise you have been playing wrong all this time, and you should be grateful to find out as your opponents dead certain have had an upperhand in the armour-race till now.
Click to expand...

i guess i was indeed wrong in this one :D
used to play 5th ed and have a feeling u could take only 1 armour, and i though it to be so with this edition but looking at the suit definitions more closely i guess its okay.
and if someone has had a +1 upperhand in armor race couldnt care less : P its just a game anyway. our group have had tons of rules wrong in the past anyway. actually hilarious now to think about it how wrongly we played back in the day :D
 
I've had a single egged priest on foot kill 10 HE archers alone.

I don't think the guy is useless, not at all, and there are plenty of ways to suit him up nicely.

:

The ASF sword.
The Egg.
Enchanted shield makes a cheap but durable chief.
Cheap magic weapon (your pick) for a magic attack.

Basically he goes well with a lot of stuff that we normally wouldn't use on our Scar vets or Old bloods because it would take away something from their ton of attacks and durability - the little guy is much cheaper, and hence much more suited for a glass cannon kind of role. Even dis mounted he can be outfitted with a 3+ save (some armies have to live with that, it's weird) and retain great movement with MS 6.

For mounts :

Both flying mount options, even the Stegadon option is tempting as a BSB, being more durable than the Carno, and at about the same price range.

LD 6 isn't impressive but it's better than a normal skink, and it's in the "will mostly make" category, sadly not in the "should mostly make" category.

I don't think there's a big enough downside to him, since he went down to 40 pts, that i wouldn't field 1 of these guys at 2.5K, heck i'd try to squeeze him in at 1K just for a love of the models, but he'd still be useful.

The thing is, he clears chaff, he clears warmachines, and he does that well. But he WILL die (on foot at least) to any decent unit, if he's on his own (probably to shooting as well unless you can keep him in combat).

In a unit he loses the Chaff clearing, warmachine clearing role, but gives a Cohort some needed punch, and he ain't bad at it. the 3+ save isn't too bad to make your opponent focus the unit instead of him either.

On a mount he still clears chaff, hunts warmachines, and can relatively safely flank units of core models, even some special.


He isn't the "kick all stuff i meet" kinda guy we know from a cowboy, or "anchor my saurus pl0x" kinda guy we get in a footed saurus with CoC or BSB, but more like a "glass cannon toolkit, pick your own pieces and needs and go".


To summarize :

He's our expendable glass cannon kit.

Whereas our normal heroes are less expendable but more tough. They hit harder, they cost more, they do more, they're less mobile.
 
have anyone ever tried something like this?

Im trying this one:

Cheif
Terradon
Ogreblade
LA
Shield
Dragonhelm



and this one out next game:

Cheif
Terradon
Stegahelm
LA
Shield
Spear

3 flying S6 attacks at I6 should have its uses, and I just like the thought flying impacts for warmachine hunting..I can tell that part works pretty well (who strikes first now eh you pesky elves?)
 
The idea of a buff skink riding a terradon.
Interesting, but highly disturbing.
I'm personally obsessed with skink chiefs as they're so cheap. And I have tons of the models.

On foot (I play skaven a lot. This guy and his skinks will join the saurus for a double team on a clanrat horde (usually of 40))
I don't focus on defence because there is a scar vet in the saurus, so the chief is often ignored.
Chief.
Light armour.
Additional hand weapon.
Egg of quango.

If the egg gives a good result, this guy will often dish out 8 wounds. That's quite nice, as combined with the saurus and scarvet, (the unit always perform excellently) that's about 18 wounds.
 
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