8th Ed. Skink + Kroxigor Units - what's the point?

[Clockwork]

Movement caps out at 10 (unfortunately). When 8th first came out, that is all I ran. I bet I played 5 games before I was pointed to the BRB rule that states that no characteristic can go above 10. Birona's is still brutal when you get it off at the higher level in the first turn though.

Probably more of a rules question, but on the FAQ Timewarp is changed from Movement to Movement Allowance, which presumably means it can go over 10?

 

[Arli]

Unfortunately, in the BRB it states under characteristics that none of the stats on the statline can go above 10. That is what caps it.

 

[Clockwork]

Ah, the Movement characteristic is actually fully named Movement Allowance, meaning that you are correct it cannot go over 10. Thanks!

 

[Glen_Savet]

Movement caps out at 10 (unfortunately). When 8th first came out, that is all I ran. I bet I played 5 games before I was pointed to the BRB rule that states that no characteristic can go above 10. Birona's is still brutal when you get it off at the higher level in the first turn though.

I believe that this is incorrect. The Movement Characteristic isn't doubled, it's their actual movement. The text of the spell makes no mention of characteristics. I admit I could be wrong, but I've seen it played this way before.

As a tangent, the FAQ rules that movement can go above 10, but it only confirms that with regard to the Random Movement special rule.

 

[Arli]

I wish that were the case. I would love to field movement 12 skrox, Kroxigors, and movment 16 Cold Ones(that would actually make those more playable). Until I see a faq that directly says that it can go above 10, I have to play it capped at 10.

 

[rothgar13]

Movement caps out at 10 (unfortunately). When 8th first came out, that is all I ran. I bet I played 5 games before I was pointed to the BRB rule that states that no characteristic can go above 10. Birona's is still brutal when you get it off at the higher level in the first turn though.

I believe that this is incorrect. The Movement Characteristic isn't doubled, it's their actual movement. The text of the spell makes no mention of characteristics. I admit I could be wrong, but I've seen it played this way before.

As a tangent, the FAQ rules that movement can go above 10, but it only confirms that with regard to the Random Movement special rule.

The FAQ changed that. It's now the actual characteristic that is being doubled.

 

[Zorack]

Got to ask, what is it that makes the unit immune to Stomps?

The Krox are immune yes, but why does that transfer to the squishies?

/Z

 

[FlowinEnno]

Got to ask, what is it that makes the unit immune to Stomps?

The Krox are immune yes, but why does that transfer to the squishies?

/Z

Because the unit as a whole does only have one unit type, and that is "Unique". Since Stomp only works on Infantry, it doesn't work on Skrox units.

 

[Zorack]

Got to ask, what is it that makes the unit immune to Stomps?

The Krox are immune yes, but why does that transfer to the squishies?

/Z

Because the unit as a whole does only have one unit type, and that is "Unique". Since Stomp only works on Infantry, it doesn't work on Skrox units.

Thank you

 

[Qupakoco]

It's also in the FAQ. So if your opponents argue with you, just point them here: http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1610148a_FAQ_Lizardmen_V1_4.pdf

 

[ThatFrogGuy]

Another benefit is that they are leadership 7. I have found that that makes the difference for me in more than one occasion. I look at it as an upgrade to the unit. For just the cost of one Krox you give a skink unit Fear, Immunity to Stomp and +1 leadership. That alone is a good investment to me.

The thing is, without Kroxigors, I would never even consider bringing a unit of Skinks. Skink Skirmishers, yes, but Skinks? Heck no.

Two Words: Tetto'Ecko

 

[Arli]

Tetto is by far our best special character. Well worth the points.

 

[ThatFrogGuy]

Can someone please quick explain to me how the step up rule works with the skinks in a Skrox unit?


Meaning, if I have a Horde of skrox, say...10 skinks in front rank, 5 krox behind that, then 40 more skinks behind that....when do the krox step up to the front rank...when ALL 50 skinks are dead, or when just the first 10 are? And could you please help by citing relevant passages in the main rule book?

Thanks!

 

[Arli]

The Kroxigors will not make it into the front rank until there are only 8 skinks left (so 42 have to die in order for the kroxigors to move to the front rank). Then, only one Kroxigor will be up there. The rule is on page 41 of the Lizardmen rulebook. However, in your example, with 5 kroxigors, your flanks are open and any flank charge will allow the targeting of your kroxigors.

 

[ThatFrogGuy]

Tonight I used a 24 skink, 3 Krox unit against some HE.

I went into the battle with them arrayed 6 skinks up front, 3 krox, then 3 more ranks of 6 skinks each.

I attacked a unit of 13 archers and a mage, all High Elf.

I expected to lose maybe 10 skinks? I lost 13.

The Krox and the left over skinks could not compensate for a weak showing during combat...although I only lost resolution by 2 (i had charged, and had a banner...the extra ranks helped, but not to the point of saving my bacon.

Am I doing something wrong? I tried to flank, but during the entire game there were only 2 flank charges, 1 by me and 1 by the HE player...so I just don't see how they are really that effective?

With full command structure, and 3 Krox, that unit was worth 307 total points...too expensive IMHO.

I'd rather run a 2x2 bus of Krox and just be done with it, I think?

 

[Devean]

High Elves will be nasty to skrox units with those re-rolls to hit! They're pretty much going to get every attack through as a casualty...I think in your case (against HE's), skrox are a bit weaker.

...although I only lost resolution by 2 (i had charged, and had a banner...the extra ranks helped, but not to the point of saving my bacon.

Regarding the CR, you should be testing on the unmodified leadership of 7 even though you lost by 2. The way you phrased the above makes it sound like you didn't use the steadfast rule (you have more ranks than opponent=steadfast...unless you're disrupted). This is really important because it could mean the difference between your skrox staying or breaking.

Anyway, just wanted to check

IMO the skrox can really only be used to flank in larger point games (when you also have saurus blocks). As you said, they are a big points cost (to be effective) and won't have much support in a smaller game (<1500)

 

[ThatFrogGuy]

High Elves will be nasty to skrox units with those re-rolls to hit! They're pretty much going to get every attack through as a casualty...I think in your case (against HE's), skrox are a bit weaker.

...although I only lost resolution by 2 (i had charged, and had a banner...the extra ranks helped, but not to the point of saving my bacon.

Regarding the CR, you should be testing on the unmodified leadership of 7 even though you lost by 2. The way you phrased the above makes it sound like you didn't use the steadfast rule (you have more ranks than opponent=steadfast...unless you're disrupted). This is really important because it could mean the difference between your skrox staying or breaking.

Anyway, just wanted to check

IMO the skrox can really only be used to flank in larger point games (when you also have saurus blocks). As you said, they are a big points cost (to be effective) and won't have much support in a smaller game (<1500)

After hitting the archers, I did have to test, and I did do it against unmodified leadership. I stuck around, they didn't break...that was good.

Then I got flanked by swordmasters, rear arc no less, and died to a man. Alas. I was hoping to have broken the archers and caused them to flee...i didn't reckon on killing them off, but had I been able to pursue, the Skrox would have been outside of the swordmasters range.

But, if wishes were fishes, we'd all be named Gorton, or so my grandpappy once said.

This was a 2200 point playtest for a 2500 point tourney I got on this coming saturday.

I know of at least 2 HE armies that will be there.

Orcs and gobbos will be big, as well.

 

[silverback]

Though this sounds to me mostly like a case of you rolled like crap I will say I am generally not a fan of the skrox units for this very reason. They die in droves to archers and give away more CR with skink deaths than they are able to compensate for with krox or ranks. I'm guessing the elf unit was only worth about half the points and they held.

 

[ThatFrogGuy]

Though this sounds to me mostly like a case of you rolled like crap I will say I am generally not a fan of the skrox units for this very reason. They die in droves to archers and give away more CR with skink deaths than they are able to compensate for with krox or ranks. I'm guessing the elf unit was only worth about half the points and they held.

my consensus as well.

 

[T`hinker`er]

My experience using 24+3 SKrox against HE has been mostly successful. Yes, they die in droves, but against HE so do Saurus. At least the Skrox hold steadfastly and the 9 attacks at Str 6 kill a lot of expensive elves (better still if you can buff them to re-roll their 1's), giving me time to get another unit into the fight (Steg or Saurus) and break the enemy. DO NOT try this until you have taken off a rank or two from the elves with your salamanders and skink shooting. Time is on your side - the HE wants to get into combat as quickly as possible - you don't. Skrox are a wonderful anvil unit, as long as you use them as such and don't expect them to win on their own.