RUN UP (This might be badly written but I am caught between "im tired" and "I want this written while fresh" so here goes. Will look through it and correct tomorrow) His list was Daemon Prince: Level 4 Wizard; Lore of Death; -- got leech, cares, soulblight and........SUN! Daemon of Nurgle; Exalted Gift; -- got the +D3 to S A and I sword Chaos armour; Daemonic flight Herald of Nurgle: Battle Standard; Greater Locus of Fecundity 25 Plaguebearers of Nurgle: Banner Of Swiftness; Plagueridden; musician; standard bearer 12 Pink Horrors of Tzeentch -- got gateway 4 Beasts of Nurgle 8 Fiends of Slaanesh 5 Chaos Furies: Daemon of Nurgle 5 Chaos Furies: Daemon of Nurgle 4 Plague Drones of Nurgle: Banner Of Eternal Flame; Rot Flies (Plague Proboscis); Plaguebringer; standard bearer My spells was Beast priest: amberspear and wyssans, Heavens priest: iceshard and harmonic My Deployment From my left to right Far corner :10 Skink skirmishers Mid Skrox Salamander Ancient Steg Scarnosaur CoR with OB Behind mid Skrox unit with 1 krox - Priests here Rippers In front of mid 10 and 10 skink skirs His Depoyment From my left to right Far corner Pink Horrors Flank Beasts of nurgle Mid Plaguebearers with Herald - gets the TOAD! Behind flank 5 and 5 furies Behind beasts Drones Right most flank Fiends and DP I then deployed both Chameleon units close to his horrors I will explain the game in highlights to narrow it down to what matters: Daemons turn 1 The game starts with him getting first turn. Everything moves up, fiends almost in my face and the DP tries to get to the flank- Nothing important in magic, he rolled something on winds of magic that killed a single ripper and 2 skinks. Lizardmen turn 1 I move out skinks to shoot and offer bad charges. Monsters, infantry and cav goes up a few inches to be able to charge him next turn if he keeps his pace. I nit 2 wounds on plaguedrones with amberspear Gets harmonic of on chameleons Gets wyssans of on CoR in case of a couple possible charges Chameleons violate the Horrors, dropping 5 in total Salamander lays a wound on beasts - regen off Skinks puts down a beast and lays another wound. Daemon turn two Dont remember much happened. A lot of charges got my skinks and sally running, He placed his harpies in front of my monster duo and my CoR ...he then rolled 1 and 1 on Winds, killing of all but 1 harpy infront of the monsters (enough to prevent my carno to charge ) and 3 alive infront of my CoR. Lizardmen turn 2 I underestimated the beasts. I plunged my Skrox into them, hoping to kill em off with a combination of wounds and instability. Fate would not have it so. the krox didn't put out a single wound. Moved out the rippers for a potential flank charge, should he want to charge his bearers into the skrox. Stega charged the harpy...by harpy OB moved away from CoR to participate in the fight elsewhere. Beast priest got spear of on drones didnt wound. Chameleons reduces the horrors to 1 guy. Daemons turn 3 Drones charges skrox in flank and plaguebearers got in on the corner, striping me of steadfast. They got mutilated dealing almost no wounds due to the -1 to hit. They got run down and the drones reformed. Daemon prince charged carno who fled, redirected towards priest bunker but failed the charge. He got behind my lines and attempted to leech my beast priest. Wanted to save dice for sun and figured that he might die, so I popped his cube....I rolled a 1.....priest took 1 wound. I dispelled sun. Lizardmen turn 3 Stega and OB charged the beasts, flunking all but 1 out of 5 impact hits, dealing 2 wounds. Put another wound on the beast (yes, both of them together). They lost combat and a beast died to instability. Rippers charged plaguebearer in flank, fully aware they would not win, but I hoped they would take a rank with them, in order for me to have a bigger chance breaking them with the CoR who charged the 3 harpies and was set up for an overrun. This happend: The rippers got 2+1 attack from the toad rages...put down 1 wound in total, took 2 wounds back and stood on a break test. The CoR put out 2 wounds and was left in the single harpy for another turn. 2 chameleon units + a unit of 10 skirmishers put 5 wounds on the drones, were only 1 got through. Beast priest miscast a spear that didn't wound and lost all his levels. Daemons turn 4 Yadda yadda yaddaDaemon Prince charged COR set up a purple sun Threw max 4 dice I threw 6 It got through (regardless of lvl advantage btw) Killed 3 CoR My Steg My Carno My OB Good game. In regard to the experiment: Im not sure if its the restrictions, me having tons of points from leaving the slann, or both, but I dont miss him one bit. The great frustration that follows the massive pts investment not doing anything but playing equal with normal lvl 4 casters wasn't present. The great stress of "I have to protect this by any means necessary" Wasn't present. The LD 8 instead of 9 didn't matter one bit. The priests did fine and the only thing I missed was a few more spells (figuring that 3 priest might actually be worth it). They cast just as well as the slann. Got the same amount of spells of, and was far easier to move around / to safety if need be. The lvl2 vs lvl 4 never made a difference. Not even the engine made a difference. The skinks made the throws. Im not saying "dont play the frog", im just saying: magic works without him. Beast and Heavens are nice lores that synergize awesomely, and from now on I will really need to think what my army is trying to achieve before picking magic, as the slann is no longer auto include for me. In other words: I see where you are coming from Sleb, I truly do, and im looking forward to play on, even though this match ended by the hated hands of a Sunning DP. Tl:dr - Nothing in our book is truly good against nurgle - Purple sun is ridiculous as always - Harpies are a P in the A (various P words will fit this, take your pick) - Chameleons are auto include for everyone every time everwhere - If you didn't agree with the above, rethink it. - Priests are fine magic presence, while the spoiling of having 8 Spells on one caster was felt - I still don't like rippers, even though the matchup might have been bad....but somehow it always seems that way.
So he won? I only read the last part. I'm tired as well._. Anyway I disagree with your slann conclusion, but I'll make a post tomorrow with my confession. It's good though that you're happy with your results from the experiment regardless of the win/lose. If these games convinces you to try out priests some more you can always work a out a more competitive list afterwards, or whatever your goal with this is.
Yes it couldn't be helped. The scroll was used and the 6 dice in my hand wasn't enough to stop the sun (rolled, 4, 2, 1, 1, 2 or something across that amount..) The goal is to see if Sleboda has been right in his statement: "The frog isnt worth its points in magic". I am slowly getting his point of view: I dont think the Slann makes up for his cost when putting disciplines on him, as he rarely performs better than any lvl 4 would. And now it seems that even two lvl 2's can get the same effect on the game as he can....SEEMS...it needs further testing. With that said im not writing him of, as he opens up some army builds the skinks dosnt, but as written above I am no longer auto-including him.
=> Maybe I misunderstood. I thought the comp rules changed the point values of certain things, so I was asking what your armies would have cost without those changes. Did I read that wrong? Also, I read you other posts and will comment more later. Too much to get into right now other than to say I will give chameleons another try tomorrow.
oh I see! my bad. Carno was 100 pts cheaper A.Steg was 25 pts cheaper, so it would have been 125 more without restricts