8th Ed. Stegadon and Combat Result

[newlmplayer]

Hey I just wanted to know what you guys thought of a Stegadon dying in close combat and how the remaining skinks are added or not added to combat result. So if I have 5 skinks remaining and they get crushed by the stegadon do they get counted for CR or not? Thanks.

 

[Dyvim Tvar]

This is something that as far as I know is not covered by any FAQ, Rule Book, or Army Book provision.

It is worth noting that the same issue arises with Mnsters and Handlers when the Monster dies, and there is no FAQ or rule directly covering that situation either.

Some people would argue that the situation should be analogized to killing blow against a multi-wound model. In that case, you count the full remaining wounds of the model towards combat resolution.

However, in the KB case, you count all the wounds that would have otherwise been necessary to remove the model. In the case of the Steg and Monsters and Handlers, killing the crew is not necessary to remove the model. As a result, I don't think remaining crew should be counted for the purposes of combat resolution.

That's just my interpretation though. Again, it's not really covered by the rules as presently written.

 

[Slanputin]

I believe only the Stegadon itself is counted; the Skink Crew is ignored. There are numerous passages to suggest this on the Stegadon profile (p.55). Considering only the Stegadon is counted for victory points, then the Monster itself will probably only count for CR:

For victory point purposes, only the beast itself counts, unless it is ridden by a character. Non-character Skinks are ignored.

Also, as all remaining Skink crew are killed along with the mount, and the Skink crew are not delimited points-wise on the army profile, the Stegadon itself is representative of the entire unit and thus the only thing counted for CR.

This would only change if there is a character on board: current rules dictate that the presence of a Skink Chief or Priest turns the unit into a Monstrous Mount, therefore CR will come from the loss of the Stegadon and the character (if the character dies during the round too).

If taken as a character mount then one of the crew is displaced by the character. Stegadons of both types are treated as monstrous mounts with more than one rider..

Similarly for M&H I'm pretty sure if the Salamander/Razordon is slain, then the Skinks are removed as casualties. The Skinks appear to be additional, optional wounds that reduced the units proficiency (eg. extra shooting and close combat attacks for Stegadons) that don't count towards the wound total.

I wouldn't count Skinks towards CR.

 

[Stonecutter]

As Dyvim Tvar has indicated there is no rule that specifically covers this issue. The primary reason for this is that the lizzie book is an older one and hence its ridden monsters have not been updated to be like the O&G arachnorok where the monster and crew are a single model with combined stats, much like a chariot. Steggie also doesn't come under monster & handler rules since it is not classified as such. Also, unlike M&H, the crew of steggies can be targeted independent of steggie itself. The good news is that this should be cleared up when the new book comes out next month!! (we hope).

In the interim, my personal view is that since the crew can be targeted and wounded separate from steggie, they should count as additional wounds inflicted if they are killed, regardless of whether it was directly or indirectly via the death of steggie.

 

[Dyvim Tvar]

Hopefully we only have a couple more weeks to worry about this before it becomes a non-issue.