TOW Updated thoughts on the Slann

As in get 2 for the same cost? Heh

 

Cheaper yeah. Obviously. I'd wish for that.

But even at current cost I'd like him more if I could double up.

A BM and illusion slann on the table would be so nice. If you could fit 2 eotg as well... oh boy

I also feel like I'd be more willing to take a large TG block if they were protecting 2 slann.

Also we are one of the few armies locked to so few wizards. Only 1 level 4 possible, and our level 2 competes for a slot versus our combat lord (1 old blood or priest per 1k)

 

Slann is definitely a must competitively. Need it for the dispelling and then you have to make its strange group of abilities work. The below are what I use - typically I always make room for a Carnosaur (ScarVet mostly), Ancient Steg and at least 20 Skinks on top.

(485)
Battle Magic
Higher State of Mind
Lore Familiar (Hammerhand, Fireball, Pillar of Fire, Arcane Urgency)
Ruby Ring
Itxi Grub
BSB
War Banner

Sets up centrally to maximise LoS, Inspiring Presence, BSB. Enters combat to break units with +3 combat res and Hammerhand.

(445)
Illusion
Higher State of Mind
Lore Familiar (Shimmering Dragon, Crystal Column, Doppelganger, Miasmic Mirage)
Dragon Slaying Sword
Power Scroll
+Arcane Vassal

Positioned flexibly to attack monsters. Use Arcane Vassal to help with Mirage and Column (Skink Priest) Power Scroll to help Doppelganger get off.

(380)
High Magic
Becalming Cogitations
Wand of Jet

Cheapest Slann I will take - sets up in the 24'-27' gap. Uses High Magic to buff and be there to dispel. Hopefully get Walk Between Worlds but otherwise don't need LoS as much so can hide.

 

Awesome! Thanks!
What have been the highs and lows of the #2 Dragon hunter Ghost battle toad? I worry about him going against High T enemies and either whiffing or just getting Snotted before he can swing

 

Truthfully, it hasn't been that great. Miasmic Mirage is very good but it doesn't get you points. The problem is mostly the Slann's maneuverability is weak so the Dragon can flee, rally (most are Ld 10) and then march, wheel to face somewhere else and charge next turn before your Slann can face up again.

Mostly it's the deterrence effect. When you want to pull the trigger, it still has to be cast and not dispelled AND roll the 6. It's probable, but not a lock. I haven't taken a Dragon down yet, but won games on its deterrence effect.

Don't stress about swinging last - if you're going in, you're all in, and generally 5 wounds 5+ ward will get you at least past one round of a magic weapon.

 

I think you are little harsh on Summon Elemental Spirit with an E, I'd probably push it up to a C because it ONLY damages enemies, so much more useful in a crowded space. Not as good as Pillar of Fire as you can't control it, but still useful.

Earthen Ramparts for a D seems a little harsh too. Its a nice spell to toughen up something that is likely to get charged, and the low linear obstacle auto-kills Fanatics and is impassable to Chariots.

I think looking at the Lore to choose you need to think about how the spells synergise with the rest of the army. For me this makes my current skink heavy list love Elementalism the most. Plague of Rust to improve the number of wounds getting through. Wind Blast is always good. Earthen Ramparts can help Skinks beat off other skirmishers/chaff, and Summon Elemental Spirit can deter charges etc if you get lucky. I'm also playing with Becalming Cogitation so keeping the Slann back to cast reliably whilst still being able to dispel.

 

I have run Elementialism a few times and I just think its fool's gold. Looks alright but never seems to deliver anything. YRMV

 

I've found Illusion is more of a trap, because the Slann don't have any bonuses to cast and the casting values for the good spells are high, so unless you are spending even more on Power Scrolls. I can't see a list that Necromancy would make sense.

I think High the 3rd best lore. Walk Between Worlds is nice, being Ethereal for the extra protection, and Reserve Move to pop in & out of range for magic missiles is nice. I think Fiery Convocation is only good against large units, and those aren't the things I'm typically worried about. Shield of Saphery cannot be cast into combat and only works on our turn which dimishes its utility.

Between Battle & Elementalism I think its much closer and really depends on the enemy and army compositions as to which is more useful. Plague of Rust is a massive synergy for Skinks, much better than Curse of Arrow Attraction. Wind Blast is a very good magic missile - and with S5 and AP -1 can hurt 'tough' enemies much more than Fireball. Pillar of Fire is a bit better than Summon Elemental Spirit, due to being controllable. So I'd probably consider it fairly even. If you have a Lore Familiar I think Elementalism narrowly is better, but Battle Magic has a bit more depth so better if you aren't taking it.

 

Double EotG is the way to the bonus. But for a solo slann. Yeah

 

Have you ever considered guys an ethereal slann with arcane familiar ?
The idea is to get the signature from battle magic and roll 3 spells on elementalism. (I am not a fan of battle magic)

 

I'm assuming you want Hammerhand to use in melee? If you are going down that route would an appropriate magic weapon and Spectral Doppelganger be better? If so Illusion with Lore Familiar to guarantee Doppelganger (as well as the other tasty Illusion spells) may be a better option.

I like Elementalism, particularly Plague of Rust to allow my skinks to poison things. The Assailment spell does suck though, so on its own not a good choice for a melee Slann. Without Lore Familiar you've only got a 50/50 chance of getting Plague of Rust. I really want that and Wind Blast. Its only about a 20% chance of getting both with 3 spells.

I'm not sure what's not to like in Battle Magic. Curse of Cowardly Flight and Oaken Shield are both not wanted on a Slann (I guess you could join a unit to use Oaken Shield), but you can just take Lore Familiar and pick the others, and then save on the magic weapon.

 

Illusion is quite BAD except for doppelganger and you need 95 magical point to make it works. My version have 15 magical points and much better spells to use (its not only based on one spell/combo). Spectral Doppelganger sucks a bit since is also (as all assailment spells) based on slann initiative that is 2. If you want to kill a dragon or something else with magical attack well you will fail. I am just considering a way to have both the battle magic assilment spell and some good spell of elementalism for a cheap price. Usually i play only elementalism with lore familiar but i don't think it's worth it. Slann is too costy

 

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your intent? Why do you think Hammerhand is worth risking missing out on Plague of Rust and/or Wind Blast?

The build I proposed, taking Column of Crystal, Doppelganger, Mirage and either Glittering Robe or Monsoon, isn't going to kill any dragons, something else in the army will have to do that. However it will provide a degree of battlefield control through Mirage/Crystal/Monsoon which hopefully set up favourable charges for the heavy hitters, or at least keep the skinks out of trouble.

The Doppelganger combined with killing Blow is primarily a threat against cav/inf without magical attacks. I'll try and use Ethereal & Fly to set up favourable charges, with other units if their static CR needs it. Even with the Axe and getting Doppelganger off, 2D6 S4 AP-1 Killing Blow, won't scare a Chaos Lord on Dragon or Chariot, but it may scare Dragon Ogres, Pegasus Knights, solo mages or maybe a bunker an enemy mage is hiding in. I just need to keep it away from magical attacks.

My last couple of games I've been running Becalming Cogitation and Elementalism, trying to sit 24.1" from enemy wizards so I can actually get some spells off without allowing a wizardly dispel. I think Elementalism is good for that because several of the spells have good range. Battle magic works will with that too for similar reasons.

 

My last couple of games I've been running Becalming Cogitation and Elementalism, trying to sit 24.1" from enemy wizards

So i have usually played it! Well I don't know exactly but just considering other way to play it. I am not so convinced of doppleganger due the cost and the risks. Then generally I don't like to have only one caster in the army in melee and he cant dispel if he is blocked in melee

 

I have tried Illusion with BC, but a lot of the spells are relatively short range, so sitting outside the 24" and dispelling isn't great as then you rarely have good targets for Mirage or Crystal Column. I'm thinking that with a more resilient configuration I can move it further forward and get those spells off. A bit of punch to help deter unwanted aggression, and enough punch it can clear out opportunistic targets. Its just something to try.