AoS The new Battletome: A Discussion

If you factor in alliegence abilities, a lot of the problems you underlined aren’t there. Scaly skin greatly improves survivability. We also have stuff like starseers to buff up our charges.

as for range, Stegadon bows are rock solid and can put excellent pressure on opponents for a decent price

 

They cant fly because that requires a buff. Via Slann command or a spell. So anything in our army can fly ....

A lot of our units require more buffs from characters to really be all that effective.

 

yes and it takes resorses we can only do so much with CP so the more a unit needs to work the less usfull it is you could buff a 4+ save 10 wound stegadon 12 if TL or you could buff a 40 block of warriors or skinks not both

no the problems are still there scaly skin will not save a carnasaur from 30 irondrakes or anything skaven OBR or DK and even then your giving up teleports for it.

 

Excuse me, but if monsters have weakness, this doesn't make them bad. Every top tier monster which comes to mind for me is a 300+ pts, often about 400, which is also often a character. Our most expensive one is 270. And while they are vulnerable to mass damage 1 and mortal wounds, they are exellenct at damage 2 and d3 units, which are quite common. And there are anough "delete anything" units in the game, so this is not only our monsters' problems.

It is like saying "saurus blocks sucks, because, they are 32mm bases and will struggle to reach enemy even with spears and will be destroyed by spells like Plague".

 

right but just because they are cheep does not make them good. your right the problems our dinosaurs have are shared by all monsters not just ours. so for a monster to be considered good they ether have to be outstanding see stone horns and terrorgiests(both very strong without any buffs) or do something beyond just fight like the harvester.
middling monsters don't cut it durthu, half the skaven lords, alariel, thunder tusks, grogons, greater deamons of nurgle, every IDK monster, magmadroths, general on gryphon. all of these are better then our dinosaurs and all of them see very little play as they just can't do well enough to rise above the curve.
that's not to say we can't use our dinosaurs(i like the TL missile carnasuar) just that they aren't strong enough to be considered good units

 

Yeah looks like everything is shit except for skinks because buying a thousand skinks makes GW more money, cunts.
(all allegiances are... eh... not great - fangs of sotek is pretty damn epic but only if you field 300 skinks and 2 slanns (and pick the summon build) so that's a thing)

Also - carnosaurs didn't get a slight buff, they got nerfbatted to an age prior to life - there's no "spammable damage booster" anymore, they're now just... JUST dinos, worse off than they used to be

Bastiladons can shoot twice if you set it up right, but that's not worth the 3 wounds I get out of it, so huzzah I guess...
and there's a new fugly plastic brick that costs 40 bucks and makes me want to puke

I'm seriously starting to lose interest in warhammer altogether now, I take it all back, I wish they never updated/fucked up my favorite faction!!

 

ok well shoot your jumping the gun a bit

no not at all krox are good salamanders are good saurus warriors and knights are good. they just need a good list to function

also no fangs is great but so is koatl and drakoliths tail has masive potential of just for it's command ability. not sure why you think they all suck

carnasuars got better just not by much +1 to hit has always been better then +2 attacks to a bad weapon profile and the rest of what you can stack on one is bonkers if not better used elsewhere

2 shots from a sun cannon averages 8-12 damage not great but thats not his job

we got a solid buff in this book but we play very differently i am sad at what we lost and a bit miphed with what they didn't give us but over all it's a net positive

 

*Dracotion's tail is all about spawning them in later, which.... doesn't do anything, really. cool, useless
*Fangs of sotek is an extra shot for your skinks when they get charged, and a very cheesy serpent dagger, cool but nothing does guaranteed damage and it's not like I'm gonna be able to snipe any non-cannonfodder units, so that's a 5+ "kill one skeleton", nnnice and worthless.
*Koatl's kuntz are +1 to hit rolls for your saurus, not where you need them (on skinks)
*Thunderlizards is an extra shot for bastiladons or EOTGs, so... base your army entirely around those? I'd prefer death

Summoning has been nerfed to "D3 per spell" and "only for the first spell" so now a summon build needs like 5 slanns, lameeeee
I wanted some cool synergy, but no - they removed the cool synergy like "reroll hits near Astroliths" and gave us "slight Kroxigor buff if they're near skinks" - but other than that, kroxies are still bad, so.... great, I guess I don't want either of those, forget skinks altogether.

I want my cheesebuild back, god damn it!

 

"Jumping the gun"
Spent 2 hours digging through the book and the app
I've told myself "oh this is a strategy, yes I'll do thi-" only to then discover it was worthless like 12 times in a fucking row.

Lizards are dead - they've been replaced with these nooblords

 

it bypasses our general slow movment and lets you teleport half your army to where it needs to be the comand ability is great and the artifact is solid protection

if built right a block of skinks deals 34 damage a turn your going to kill way more then just a skeleton

ok harsh but also not true our saurus are meatgrinders now and koatle lets you run CP neutral which is great for our stuff now

posibly the wording is fairly fuzzy we are waiting for the FaQ it is a shame that summoning took a hit but it was always going to

our book is allabout sinergy we can get 2 "2 2/3/-1/1 2 1" 3/3/-/1 attacks on our guys and krox got waaaay better they got more rend their bights got fixed and +1 to hit meens they can hit on 2s

aaah now i see the problem

 

then you did a piss poor job most people here saw the good stuf right off the bat and wizard and i are finding broken crap all the time like our immunity to battle shock

 

Saurus are downright awesome

 

@Erta Wanderer. Are you referring to Cold-Blooded? Does it actually work that way, meaning that Coalesced just test off of their base bravery?

 

The battletome reads; ignore bravery modifiers positive or negative. As casualties are a negative to bravery, it could well be assumed that stuff like saurus are straight up immune to battleshock

 

well as it is worded now our bravery is not effected by modifiers lossing models is a modifier so saurus can't fail and skinks only loss a guy on a 6. but i don't think thats what they intended

 

If we stay quiet, maybe they won’t errata it

 

Interesting. I didn't know if the rules considered losing models as modifiers to Bravery. I do think that may be what GW intends. If so, it makes Bravery 8 Saurus VERY hard to budge. That may actually be better than Bravery 10 that can be modified. Hmmm... oh Starborne, what have they done to you?

 

How are you getting immunity?

When doing a battleshock test, you roll a dice and add the number of dead models. You then compare this amount to the Bravery of the unit.

So you roll a dice, lets say it was a 3.
You have lost 10 Saurus, so the battleshock is 10 + 3 = 13.
If your Bravery is then 5 (which cant be modified) = You have 8 guys running.

I dont see how Cold Blooded makes you immune at all.

 

a coalest ability called cold blooded

 

See my post above