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AoS NEW *rumor*

Discussion in 'Seraphon Discussion' started by Logan8054, Jan 28, 2019.

  1. LordBaconBane
    Chameleon Skink

    LordBaconBane Well-Known Member

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    I really want to start collecting a Slaves to Darkness army. I'm thinking of building a hyper elite, low model count army that just trashes models on the field.
     
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  2. Canas
    OldBlood

    Canas Well-Known Member

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    wait till they release the new box I guess. Seems a better starting point than the current start collecting box.
     
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  3. LordBaconBane
    Chameleon Skink

    LordBaconBane Well-Known Member

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    That is what I'm thinking. I'd like a lot of Chaos Warriors, Archaon, maybe some Varanguard and knights, and a Sorcerer. Easy (although expensive) 1.5-2k list. That is less models then a unit of full stack of skinks lol.
     
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  4. ILKAIN
    Stegadon

    ILKAIN Well-Known Member

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    varanguard were 100 points each model for a bit, im sure you could do that for ALOT fewer models than a box of skinks
     
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  5. Tk'ya'pyk
    Kroxigor

    Tk'ya'pyk Well-Known Member

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    Well yeah - 10 knights (2 units of 5) and a Sorcerer on Horse totalled almost 500 points with the last General's Handbook.
     
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  6. Nart
    Razordon

    Nart Well-Known Member

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    I played against Ossiarch 1k list today. My list was a fun one, and my opponents probably wasn't best either and, on top of that, it was his first two games. But he is a 40k player so got a grasp of it fast enough.

    I brought Slann, Skink Priest, 20 skinks, Oldblood on Carnosaur and Bastiladon. He proxied Boneshaper, Soulmason, 2x20 mortek guard and Harvester.

    Some observations:

    - just as I expected, they are really slow. They need their RDP to move units and if they do so, they cannot reroll saves or get rend on spears. Even with that - 7 inches is not that much;
    - they crumble to rend and mortal wounds. Stellar tempest and razordons did a nice job at bringing them down. And 3 models restored per hero phase is not that mad actually.

    We are going to test 2k game and I'll go for Thunderquake. It think, it is really perfect battalion for seraphon to counter Ossiarch. Ossiarch doesn't have too much bodies and bastiladons and razordons kill them pretty quickly+mortal wounds from engine of gods and astrolith gives +1 to casts for stellar tempest (the best spell to kill mortek guard).
     
  7. ILKAIN
    Stegadon

    ILKAIN Well-Known Member

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    interesting fight and good first contact lol. I think you will find at 2k when they bring two units of 40 Morteks that the mortals are less effective lol. definitely cant wait to see the results.
     
  8. Nart
    Razordon

    Nart Well-Known Member

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    The more models are in the unit, the more effective Stellar Tempest is. I'm not concerned about Morteks, they are just skeletons with high save. What really scares me is a Crawler. It is hard to reach, it can one-shot slann with certain luck, so I will always have to keep it out of range, but more importantly, it will eat skink screens very fast. Arkhan with Immortis guard could also be a very big problem.

    I still think that 20/20/20 guard formation is better than 40/40/10. It is cheaper, it is easier to pilot, damage is about the same with blades. They are easier to wipe out, but still very unlikely to do in a single turn 40/20/20 is also an option.

    I also have a feeling that Crematorians will be the meta choice, because 3+ rerollable is just not enough to stop high-rend armies or those, who can spam mortal wounds.
     
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  9. Erta Wanderer
    Carnasaur

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    what was he fielding beside morteks? and why was he using comand points to move when you can just run?
     
  10. Canas
    OldBlood

    Canas Well-Known Member

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    Although that's true there'l also be a larger amount of models left after the stellar tempest. Which makes retaliating far easier. Plus since they're immune to battleshock & have healing/ressurecting they end up ridiculously effective in a meatgrinder. They will most likely grind down any opponent that doesn't just annihilate them.

    Plus, larger units benefit more from that stupid ability that allows any slain model to return wounds. Great that stellar tempest wiped out half the unit, but if half of these immeadiatly get back up again you haven't really achieved much.

    And all this becomes progressivly worse the larger the battle gets as it becomes easier for him to cover more ground with his healing.

    Also the harvester's ability isn't unique, so get 2-3 harvesters, have them stand on top of eachother & laugh as each dead enemy returns multiple wounds... Has that been F.A.Q. yet for it to only trigger once per slain model?

    Also what are the point values of what he fielded?
     
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  11. Erta Wanderer
    Carnasaur

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    it has not no
     
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  12. Nart
    Razordon

    Nart Well-Known Member

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    4+ to-wound makes their damage manageable. Their strong buffs come from spells, and spells can fail/be stopped. And they don't have much to increase cast value. And they can be further debuffed with -1 to-hit. They don't have much rerolls and most reliable way to get them - a 140 point hero.
    +1 attack could make them way stronger, but than you have to take Liege-Kavalos, which is 220 points, etc, etc. Nadirite Weapons is somewhat compensates it, especially with Empower spell, but it can be applies only to a single unit. Petrifex Mortek guard is very durable, but when it comes to damage, they are not that crazy, compared to Witch Elves, Ghouls or Dwarves.

    Their ressurection is not crazy either - they need Nagash or Arkhan. Boneshaper heals max 3 models/wounds, but does nothing else and costs like 130 points. Arkhan provides reliable casts, heals 4 units and knows all the spells, but still pretty vulnerable with only 11 wounds.

    Harvester's are not as scary, as I thought. This is a 200 pts model, that babysits other units. It has tu return about 15 mortek models just to pay off. And if it is brought to the frontline, it can easily be killed. I believe it can be played out stong, but it is not a no-brain cheese. It is also meh in combat and didn't even manage to kill a Carnosaur Oldblood.

    We both brought 1000 point lists.
     
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  13. Erta Wanderer
    Carnasaur

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    well ya mortek are hyper anvils it would be silly if they killed as well as daughters that sead they are cheeeep and they hit very hard for a anvil unit and are in the top 3 for durability.
    you say they crumble to rend and mortals but lets look at that. your setup was razordons and a wizard throwing our horde buster at them. lets take this to the highest extreme and say you have 12 razordons and a star priest that's 560 points now 40 mortek and a harvester are 640 so about the same and 80 points cheaper then a hearth guard setup the other hyper anvil. assuming you get every razordon into 6" rang (not going to happen but this is a thought experiment) that is an average of 84 shots 42 will hit and 28 will wound. the mortec save twice at 4+ making that 7 and a 6+ feel no pain making it a 6 and the harvester bringing 3 back so all of the rend -1 did was 3 damage now on to the mortals asuming you get the cast of every time (not going to happen but this is a thought experiment) 12 on average 10 after FNP and 5 after harvester so 8 over all. ignoring healing that means you will have to hit it with everything for all 5 rounds to drop a block of 40. i am not convinced that they are weak to rend or mortals they are more durable then hearth guard and they are cheaper. yes they are slow but so are dwarfs. yes they don't deal as much damage but with the extra points you just buy a crawler. yes they have a vulnerable and pricey support model in the harvester but he is more durable then most support heroes even without look out sir and i would be glad to pay 200 for a hero that gave my models a 4+ FNP which is about what he does.

    so in summery im not convinced they aren't the next boogy man you can play around them but that's true of every one.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
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  14. Slikus Vaw
    Saurus

    Slikus Vaw Member

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    to change the topic some haha was thinking about the seraphons position atm. and i think they are creating a realm for seraphon (like the skaven). didnt kroak save parts of lustria before the endtimes ended? our tactics are about masterful positioning, movement, and summoning basicly. the slanns are suppossed to have predicted nd prepaired for the current events to some degree. i would imagine it taking alot to create a realm hence them being too prevalent in the lore. i think when our new book comes out its going to be a big one. save the best for last right!
     
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  15. Erta Wanderer
    Carnasaur

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    yes he did he bubbled up large chunks of lustria that is supposedly where Krogar is but they haven't been mentioned or referenced in 5 years so who knows what they will do with it. that is why so many are exited about the tome whenever it comes out we want to know just what the heck is going on with the seraphon. we don't apear in black library books exept as a aside. "we totaly smashed the orks guys .. oh ya and the seraphon where their to"
    the only meaningfull lore we have goten seems to be at ods with every thing else we know.
    that is why i'm exited and that is why im frightend that they will drop the ball again.
     
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  16. Asamu
    Chameleon Skink

    Asamu Active Member

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    RAW, it can trigger multiple times, but it requires the model to die within 3", so it's going to be pretty hard to get more than 1 to trigger at a time.

    The profile is only decent for a 200 point monster. It hits pretty hard at full wounds, but only has 10 wounds and a 4+ (or 3+) save, so it can go down pretty easily, and it degrades quickly. You can set it right behind Mortek guard so it can attack over the bases, but... they have to take damage to get a benefit from the healing rule, and if the opponent removes models from outside of 3", it does nothing, so against a big unit of grots or something, you pretty much have to wipe the unit before you get any healing.
    It's probably a bit better to just bring more guard, stalkers, or morghasts most of the time. You can bring Nagash/Arkhan/Boneshapers to get more reliable healing and also provide command points and spellcasting.

    That'd be neat, and it would make sense with how the Seraphon operate, though, IIRC, they seem to be bound to Azyr.
     
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  17. Xuil
    Saurus

    Xuil Active Member

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    They have to have realised how little there is to work with, based on our current lore. I'm not sure 'showing up ad-hoc to enforce the Slanns' great plans' cuts it either. We need a stake in something more tangible, now that we're no longer defending Lustria.

    As others have said, I'm almost as excited for a lore update as I am for new (viable...) warscrolls.
     
  18. ILKAIN
    Stegadon

    ILKAIN Well-Known Member

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    we have been mentioned in lore in the last year or so. MP has the story of the skink Starpriest taking over because the Slann on his spaceship is dying. in the spaceship is a ginormous swatch of terrain, a chunk of old Lustria that has a fully functioning ecology, and Seraphon participating in hunts and basically on vacation. so not only have we been mentioned this mention would be easily manipulated into our own realm... all the Slann bring their ships together, receive the blessing of Dracothian (we are his chosen children) and BAMM Lustria is its own Realm.
     
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  19. Erta Wanderer
    Carnasaur

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    i mentioned that "the only meaningful lore we have gotten seems to be at odds with every thing else we know." yes it's a thing but it contradicts all of the lore and until it's verified with something more substantial then a wight dwarf sentence. then we still have nothing to work with
     
  20. Canas
    OldBlood

    Canas Well-Known Member

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    taht wasn't a white dwarf story, that was a malign portents one.
     

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