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AoS Let's talk about nerfs and buffs from 3.0

Discussion in 'Seraphon Discussion' started by The Tipsy Dragon, Jun 16, 2021.

  1. Carnikang
    Carnasaur

    Carnikang Well-Known Member

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    I think the only ones who believe it's been destroyed were riding the high of the first tome.

    There are legitimate gripes to be had with it though. I will say that I feel for my local Slanneshie player who wants to make them work competitively.
     
  2. Erta Wanderer
    OldBlood

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    no it's the loss of battalions that did that
     
  3. Dread Saurian
    Stegadon

    Dread Saurian Well-Known Member

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    images (11).jpeg making out like a bandit through the first discussion of points that gw talks about
     
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  4. Womboski
    Temple Guard

    Womboski Well-Known Member

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    They mentioned in the article doing 5point changes at a time so maybe we will see more frequent but minor changes to cost of units.
     
  5. Tyranitar
    Terradon

    Tyranitar Well-Known Member

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    Gotta love the 5 point change to Nagash, that level of perfect testing and tuning is a master class in game balance :p
     
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  6. Womboski
    Temple Guard

    Womboski Well-Known Member

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    But what if a month or so from now you see across the board various units getting tweaked by 5pts and then then next couple months the same happens. No clue what pace they are going to set for point changes but with their "system" and talk it sounds like they are more open to that

    Perfect balance is nice in theory but gets stale if you play that forever. You will know who is going to win before the game starts based of this "perfect" balance. At least with changing things up either by changes like 3.0 or just 5pt tweaks across the board it's good to keep the meta from getting too stale
     
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  7. Erta Wanderer
    OldBlood

    Erta Wanderer Well-Known Member

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    i think we can asume it will be the same pace as always twice a year

    tell that to chess
     
  8. Christopher
    Terradon

    Christopher Well-Known Member

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    I wish I knew how to paste in that GIF of Orson Welles giving the standing ovation at the opera in Citizen Kane.
     
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  9. xoid
    Terradon

    xoid Well-Known Member

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    So the mention of chess has me thinking, is there a game that could be considered perfectly balanced where the two sides aren't working with exactly the same tools? I can't come up with one, at least right now.
     
  10. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    The first Starcraft?
     
  11. ArtoriusaurusRex
    Temple Guard

    ArtoriusaurusRex Well-Known Member

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    Mmm...if there's any game where balancing whining was more of a pastime than Warhammer, it was Starcraft, lol

    Even old Starcraft.
     
  12. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    No it doesn't. The only reason people keep thinking that is due to modern (video)games obsessivly implementing rock-paper-scissor-type balance with hard-counters.

    Step away from the constant hard-counters (and preferably from the obsessive rock-paper-scissor approach that "balances" out over an entire tournament but results in wildly unbalanced individual matches) and you'l get something that's balanced without it being stale.
     
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  13. Dread Saurian
    Stegadon

    Dread Saurian Well-Known Member

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    exactly it can be fun to get steamrolled my buddy sam and i laughed comedically for about 5 minutes when my girlfriend double turn tabled my buddys big waghhh it was hideously funny
     
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  14. Killer Angel
    Slann

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    I disagree.
    Especially Brood War was a nice balanced game.
    The fact that you can just build the units you need, lets you fix things during the game. With gw games you cannot, and that alone makes the games more balanced.
    It's the core concept of real time strategy games
     
  15. Nart
    Carnasaur

    Nart Well-Known Member

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    Whites' winrate is higher!
     
  16. VVolfsong
    Saurus

    VVolfsong Active Member

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    I can't see them ever revealing the details of that formula, but it would have been interesting to get a closer look at it. I've found myself wishing for separate point costs for Coalesced several times since our book was released, and reading that article only made that wish stronger.
     
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  17. Tyranitar
    Terradon

    Tyranitar Well-Known Member

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    I agree 100%. Starborne and coalesced are so different and value our units so differently that it's impossible that every unit could have one point value that's balanced for both. It would save a lot of whining online as well if skinks were 1-2 pts more in starborne armies for example. And saurus units could be less in starborne
     
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  18. Christopher
    Terradon

    Christopher Well-Known Member

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    This sounds imminently sensible to me. But, speaking as someone who knows next to nothing about other factions, would that mean that subsections in other armies would require (or want) similar points granularity?
     
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  19. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    Our subfactions differ more than the subfactions for other factions, noone else as a mechanic as powerfull as summoning and teleporting tied to subfactions, those are generally main-faction abilities.

    Though it's not something that's generally needed, though I can imagine there might be some others that would benefit from this approach.
     
  20. Canas
    Slann

    Canas Ninth Spawning

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    GW apparently doesn't know the difference between a skink priest and a starpriest:

    upload_2021-7-1_15-34-15.png
     
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